Derbyshire BS Group Action

Basically this is a repost of the Group Discussion Topic I posted on the 15th of November which some how managed to migrate and became a forum topic. Now the 27th has passed and we know our lives have again been put into limbo this time for 60 days and that our numbers have now swelled to 80+ I thought it might be appropriate to look at it again.
It would be interesting know how many of us were tied into one year fixed term deposits with the Derbyshire which had not reached full term before the 8th of October and which were taken out in Oct/Nov 2007 I think we are a very particular group as we were not willing investors in KSF IoM nor could we withdraw our funds. (I managed to count about seven with my previous posting) I don’t think it is taking it too far to say that we were deceived by Derbyshire IoM with the complicity of the Derbyshire Building Society into thinking we were taking out fixed term accounts with Derbyshire IoM when they both knew full well this was not the case.

Neither were the rest of us willing depositors in Kaupthing, how many of us would have saved with them given the choice?

Mark Todd MP for South Derbyshire said in the closure debate of the 6th of November; “I have a constituent who invested in Derbyshire Offshore, which was sold to Kaupthing Singer & Friedlander, and another constituent who contacted me had the prescience to query the equivalence of the guarantee given. A building society guarantee—bearing in mind that there have been no failures of British building societies ever—was regarded as robust. A guarantee offered by an Icelandic bank was certainly not equivalent, and he detected that. Could he get access to his account and trade it in? No, not without the penalties that were levied. In some cases, the societies that sold on their accounts bear some responsibility.”
Mary Creagh replied; “Indeed they do.”
Mark Todd had written to me on the 5th of November
“Thank you. In summary the accounts were explicitly guaranteed by a British building society. While building society failure is possible it has never happened - the building society movement absorb each other's failures (so far). The guarantee transferred to a foreign bank under quite separate regulatory governance. While both subsidiaries were regulated by the IoM authorities I will explore the UK regulatory interest in the acquisition, since it presumably required some oversight from the Building Society perspective.”

I have since made a FOI demand asking the treasury if the FSA had approved the sale of the Derbyshire Offshore by the Derbyshire Building Society to KSF IoM. I’m awaiting a reply.

I would ask you all to give some thought to our particular plight and where we might be able to apply pressure where other KSF depositors cannot. This is not in anyway intended to create division within the DAG but rather the opening up of another front. I personally remain committed to 100% return of our funds for everybody.

I suggest that if you have not already done so write to Graham Picken and ask him about the Derbyshire’s responsibilities in this affair. You will get a reply which I’m sure you will find unsatisfactory. I think it is worthwhile to continue to write to him replying to his replies asking specific questions such as when the sale was finalised and why the depositors were not given the option of withdrawing. We may find something in his replies which maybe useful in the future.

Now the Derbyshire has been absorbed by the Nationwide it is I feel legitimate to pose the same questions to G J Beale the CEO of the latter. You could also ask him how he can justify “Four of Derbyshire's executive directors will receive pay-offs ranging from £153,292 for chief executive Graham Picken to £322,312 for finance director Tom Wood” this kind of reward for the people who’s actions have caused us to lose our life savings and leave some of us destitute.

There has also been some discussion recently of direct action, I have been sceptical because we are too few for a mass demonstration and I’m not sure that chaining ourselves to railings is likely to generate much sympathy in the current economic climate. However picketing important branches of the Derbyshire and Nationwide would not require great numbers and with well crafted placards and flyers we could legitimately call into question the honesty and reliability of these organisations just by telling our story. If they can make it up as they go along for us what makes you thing they won’t do it to you?

Taking legal advice: Is this an option worth exploring as a group I think it probably is, money spent on the advice of a good barrister as to whether or not we have a case against the Derbyshire would not be wasted and at least we know they are good for the money. If we don’t have a case at least we will know where we stand and can concentrate our efforts in other directions.

If you haven’t done so already please write to the FSA, FSC your MP, Darling, Brown etc.

Your comments please let’s get some animation in this Group.

9/12/2008 Thanks for the continuing input, a table of what I have so far is now posted below please read it and I would be grateful if you would help me complete your entries by contacting me here rather than posting the info thanks and please keep it coming. I will be making a detailed posting on how I think we can use the information shortly but for the moment I'm awaiting for the reply to certain relevant enquiries. Please encourage anybody with fixed term bonds to contribute.

FOI.pdf426.48 KB
Derbyshire IoM Manx Bonds publish.doc74.5 KB
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Nivit - Derbyshire fixed term bonds

I think Nivit may already have me on his list, but just to be sure I'm replying here.
I took out both a one year and a 3-year bond with Derbyshire Offshore in July 2007, so both were ongoing and got transferred to KSF; obviously the 3-year bond is (or rather was!) still on-going.
I find it hard to believe that not having the option to withdraw without penalty when Derbyshire sold out was legal, but I fear it probably was or the Derbyshire wouldn't have taken such a risk. But it would be good as a first step to have the opinion of our UK legal rep on this question. I don't think we should plan to start any legal action (as opposed to advice) before the hearing on 29 Jan - hoping it won't be necessary.

Posted by anrigaut on Mon, 08/12/2008 - 10:07