UK LEGAL REPRESENTATION

  • Diver
  • 11/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
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Posted: Wed, 26/11/2008 - 12:37

Following confirmation that KSFIOM funds in the UK are subject to the 'Transfer Order' applied to KSFUK, meaning that they cannot be repatriated to the Isle of Man without Treasury consent, it has been suggested that we now officially get legal advice in the UK.

As you know we have been in very close communications with David Greene of Edwin Coe in London but, despite reports to the contrary, they have simply been advising us from a distance...they have not yet been appointed.

I am now suggesting we use any overspill from the legal fund set up for the IoM representation to take advice from solicitors and barristers in London. The purpose of taking advice would be to have a leading UK barrister look over the position we find ourselves in as well as the actions of the UK government to date (including the transfer order) and to provide an opinion as to what our options are. This is not legal action, it is simply an information gathering exercise to see where we stand.

This following request therefore goes out ONLY to those who have made a contibution to the lgal fund so far:

Please consider if you have any objections to the use of any overspill from the IoM legal fund to proceed with UK representation and opinion. If you have contributed and you object please email me at KSFIOMlegal(?)googlemail [dot] com giving me your name and donation size so that I can verify your identity.

PLEASE DO NOT EMAIL ME FOR ANY OTHER REASON OTHER THAN IF YOU WISH TO OBJECT.

Ideally I would like to be able to advise David Greene on Friday if we are going to proceed down this path so I am setting a deadline of Friday 12 noon (UK time) for objections to reach me.

As everyone who has donated has contributed varying amounts I will calculate how much the IoM representation has cost per donor. If your contribution is less than or equal to this then your objection will not stand as 'technically' you are not contributing to any overspill anyway.

If you object and you are contributing to the overspill then your contribution will be ringfenced and not used in any other way. On seeing what our funding status is following any objections I will inform the group whether or not we will be proceeding down this path.

FYI - we have had 227 separate donations to the legal fund via PayPal and HSBC

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UK LEGAL CONTRIBUTION

  • mikepapa
  • 10/10/08 n/a (free)
  • a depositor
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  • Thu, 27/11/2008 - 21:29

Diver,

I agree with your proposal for UK Legal Representaion.
If you need any additional funding please let us know.

Meanwhile may thanks for your continued efforst on our behalf.

Cheers


legtal fund

  • banna
  • 15/10/08 01/03/10
  • a depositor
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  • Thu, 27/11/2008 - 16:27

Diver,
I am in constant admiration of your work and am willing to contribute more if or when required. But do we need to be quite so coy about the total we have in the fund and the amount we have spare after the iom operation?
I certainly agree that we need legal opinion to try to attack the blockage of the 550m in UK.


UK Legal Representation

  • iak1655
  • 13/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
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  • Thu, 27/11/2008 - 11:39

I agree with what is being proposed and will contribute more if necessary.


UK Legal Representation

  • ozdog
  • 10/10/08 30/11/09
  • a depositor
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  • Thu, 27/11/2008 - 09:31

Our own contribution to the Legal Fund was modest but what has been achieved by setting up the fund has been impressive. By all means use any 'overspill' from the fund in the UK in the hope of similar results


As always, thank you for all

  • KA
  • 14/10/08 29/06/09
  • a depositor
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  • Thu, 27/11/2008 - 09:20

As always, thank you for all you are doing . I fully back your plan of action and I hope that the hardship fund is created : it is essential.
Have I contributed enough to be part of the group taking London legal advice ? If not , I will contribute whatever is needed


Agreed

  • shafted
  • 10/10/08 12/12/09
  • a depositor
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  • Wed, 26/11/2008 - 20:39

Thanks Diver I am in also if furthur funds are required.


Yes agree wholeheartedly

  • markH
  • 12/10/08 n/a (free)
  • a depositor
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  • Thu, 27/11/2008 - 08:01

It seems this is the reason why the IOM authorities are pessimistic about the prospects of having the £550m returned.

Diver, a couple of weeks ago you posted a reply to one of my messages and said that Darling referred to KSF IOM at the TSC as 'simply another unsecured creditor'.

If so, it is outrageous that we need Treasury approval to seek the return of our money.

Count me in on this one!


for what its woth my opinion

  • expat
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
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  • Thu, 27/11/2008 - 09:00

for what its woth my opinion of the uk treasury and its rfeusal to return the money is scandalous. it is the core of our immediate probem, the iom can do very little to solve this if the UK refuses to co-operate as far as i can see. it seems that darling wishes use us as political pawns in his pathetic game.
disgusted of mocow!


No objection - but Edwin Coe?

  • barnie
  • 19/10/08 31/03/10
  • a depositor
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  • Wed, 26/11/2008 - 20:21

Diver, I have no objection and would be happy to make a further donation if it becomes necessary.

Edwin Coe - I have an idea that they already represent one of the big bond issuers and should have a good insight to our position regarding 'our funds' in KSFUK.


diver, I too would like to

  • thesunnysouth
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
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  • Wed, 26/11/2008 - 17:24

diver, I too would like to contribute and also ask whether we could join forces with the solicitors etc acting for the big 4 insurance companies with resect to legal advice in London. It is in as much their interests as ours that the money is repatriated from London and they may already have, singularly or collectively, sought counsels advice. This would spread the cost and involve barristers who are already up to speed? Additionally as they represent £220m and we, collectively on this site, must equal that we would therefore represent a large proportion of the funds deposited in KSF IoM.


diver, I too would like to

  • thesunnysouth
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
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  • Wed, 26/11/2008 - 17:24

diver, I too would like to contribute and also ask whether we could join forces with the solicitors etc acting for the big 4 insurance companies with resect to legal advice in London. It is in as much their interests as ours that the money is repatriated from London and they may already have, singularly or collectively, sought counsels advice. This would spread the cost and involve barristers who are already up to speed? Additionally as they represent £220m and we, collectively on this site, must equal that we would therefore represent a large proportion of the funds deposited in KSF IoM.


By all means Diver, Go for it!

  • Jas III
  • 14/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
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  • Wed, 26/11/2008 - 17:10

I'l contribute more as well. I walked away from Latcham's and Gibson's, so I have additional money set aside availible to contribute more.
Off the record. I am going to speaking with someone inside the firm representing Iceland, and to another with the firm engaged by E&Y tommorrow, I cannot get details, but as close colleauges, they do want to give me some advice, and I hope point to the right tree to bark at! Drop me an MSG if you have any input to consider.
Cheers


London legal

  • IoM-neveragain
  • 12/10/08 30/03/10
  • a depositor
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  • Wed, 26/11/2008 - 17:02

Count me in too.
What you are doing for us all is outstanding.
Vey much appreciated.
I will email as requested saying any surplus can be used for legal advise in London and
Ask if more money is required - don't be shy!!


Additional Funds for Legal representation in London

  • saoversoix
  • 10/10/08 02/07/13
  • a depositor
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  • Wed, 26/11/2008 - 16:58

I would be totally in favour of looking into having legal representation as you describe, Diver. If more funds are needed, please let us know. I am fortunately still working, so could contribute more if necessary. Thank you for all your work on our behalf.


Judging costs Vs donations

  • romasanta
  • 16/10/08 02/10/10
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  • Wed, 26/11/2008 - 15:29

Diver - Thank you (multiple times - I try to avoid clogging up the forum with too many posts)
I agree with your planned actions. You deserve an award (perhaps we should petition the government for the queen to do something).
I have contributed, but would like to know if I need to contribute more. Can you give us any guide to what costs have been committed and what are likely future needs - perhaps per donor - so we can judge how deep we should dig. Without information it is very difficult to know if I am contributing enough - I want to keep up with costs but have to make a balance with my level of borrowing to contribute (all my savings and proceeds of sale of my home were in my KSFIOM account).


A Fund for all our ativities

  • Nixi
  • 20/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
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  • Wed, 26/11/2008 - 14:14

Hi Diver,

There are various needs for funds.. some small, some larger.
There are many, many people willing to donate to help make things happen.
Ng needs funds to keep the website up and running.. Teapot and Sleeplessnight must have needs for funds..

Would you be up for running the KSFIOMDAG FUND? Including legal?
I know you have done a huge amount.. and may have other priorities.. but, if you could, I have no doubt that the group trusts you and would back your decisions. (In any case you have been very faithful in gathering opinions before acting!) We would need to give you authority to disperse funds and we would ask that you keep good accounts for when it's all over..

If you aren't able to.. do you know a man who can?
Me, I'm an engineer and director of a small business.. Accounts.. not my strong suite.. But I can write letters, plague MPs and the Federation of Small Businesses AND give to the fund..
We just need it made easy :-)


Fund manager - yes, but not Diver

  • romasanta
  • 16/10/08 02/10/10
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  • Wed, 26/11/2008 - 15:40

Nixi, I agree with what you say about the need for someone to manage donations and costs, but please don't suggest wasting Diver's time with this. I would prefer we paid someone else to do it. We must have someone about with accountancy skills, don't you think?


That's sensible.

  • Nixi
  • 20/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
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  • Wed, 26/11/2008 - 16:35

Rosamanta, That's very sensible let's see...
N


Please read the above .....

  • Diver
  • 11/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
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  • Wed, 26/11/2008 - 13:03

thanks


legal action supporting member

  • Anonymous
  • Offline
  • Wed, 26/11/2008 - 15:21

Diver

many thanks for all your work in this respect. I have signed up as a supporting member only for now. As much as I want to, I really cannot afford to contribute anything at the moment. However, this may not always be the case, so please do include me in that supporting cast and I will keep a close eye on developments and any later requests for donations.

All good luck with this, and with outcomes tomorrow.


Diver, thank you for keeping

  • IceCrusher
  • 14/10/08 25/10/11
  • a depositor
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  • Wed, 26/11/2008 - 13:38

Diver, thank you for keeping an eye on this avenue; I agree that we should consider our options in this regard just to see where we are; what we could do; and whether it will be cost-efective. I would be happy to add more money to the pot for this evaluation if needs be.
Ice


Additional Monies for Legal Advice

  • Blades
  • 19/10/08 n/a (free)
  • a depositor
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  • Wed, 26/11/2008 - 14:47

Just to echo IceCrusher's comment that if more money is required for this additional legal advice my wife and I are willing to contribute.

Thanks again Driver for all your work


Consultants?

  • user1123
  • 14/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
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  • Wed, 26/11/2008 - 13:47

hear on the vine that the Treasury have highly paid consultants in assisting in structuring a pay back in full to all depositors, news is that it will take between 2-5 years.

Any info from you guys in finance?


Consultants

  • Ally
  • 13/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
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  • Wed, 26/11/2008 - 15:43

Ramsey Peel

Allan Bell did say yesterday in Tynwald that they had outside consultants in. Pretty sure they have a big hitter involved in a high profile case in the UK a couple of years ago.

I’ve a feeling compared to what has gone previously a lot of information and direction is going to come out (hope I’m not proved wrong) As much as you can in these situations, I’m looking forward to the Court hearing tomorrow morning, I’ll be there early, it was standing room only last time!


Ally

  • Ramsey resident
  • 22/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
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  • Wed, 26/11/2008 - 15:50

Please can you post the outcome tomorrow for those of us unable to attend

Thanks


Ramsey

  • Ally
  • 13/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
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  • Wed, 26/11/2008 - 16:35

Ramsey

Of course. I am meeting Dave Braddan at 9:30 and between us hopefully we will be able to put together some summary notes to get on the forum.