Statements received from the offices of Allan Bell, Alistair Darling & Nick Clegg

  • give_me_my_money
  • 15/10/08 n/a (free)
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Posted: Mon, 10/08/2009 - 22:47

The following scanned letters are replies received from the offices of Nick Clegg & Allen Bell. They are in follow-up to my earlier correspondence with Mr. Clegg's office (see link below), in which I asked for answers relating to,

  • why we are being used as political pawns / scapegoats for the incompetancies of the UK & IOM Governments & associated regulatory finance authorities,
  • and when we might expect ALL our money back in full + interest.

Ealier responses can be read at,

http://chat.ksfiomdepositors.org/forum-topic/replies-mps-post-them-all-h...

I am still awaiting a further response from Alistair Darling, since his initial reply was woefully inadequate. I will post an update once received.


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Putting pressure on main parties

  • Iwantmymoneyback
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Sun, 16/08/2009 - 20:00

Parties will soon be getting into electoral mode and this is the ideal time to remind them of more than 12,000 voters (10,000 from Kaupthing IOM and 2,000 from Landsbanki Guernsey) anxious to know what they can do to repair the massive injustice they experienced.

Good initiative and I encourage everybody to write to the heads of the three main political parties to keep the pressure up.


MP Pressure group

  • ItsTheft
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Sun, 16/08/2009 - 23:45

Glen07 and Banna (maybe others) have had the idea that bringing like minded MP's (IE. Those who bother to know what is happening, and the issues etc) togeher might be worthwhile. This is being discussed on the "MP's" group topic, with the list being put together.

Might be worth taking a look...

Mat


Two things stand out

  • chd
  • 13/10/08 30/09/09
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  • Tue, 11/08/2009 - 09:19

After reading these letters, two things in particular stood out:

  1. (First page Nick Clegg) "The IOM felt it had won a moral victory, since smaller depositors had voted comprehensively for the government scheme."

What Allan Bell fails to add, is that the smaller depositors (those covered under DCS) were given no indication that the DCS would pay out more quickly than the SoA. Most protected depositors, because the DCS was an empty coffer, were afraid that they would have to wait years to get their 50k compensation. The SoA promised that the protected depositors would be reimbursed by June 2010. This was the main reason why they voted for the SoA. However, since the SoA was voted down, we now learn that the DCS will pay out immediately, ie many months ahead of time of the proposed SoA. So if we had been notified that the DCS would have paid out more quickly than the SoA, it is quite obvious that NOBODY would have voted for the Scheme anyway. So how on earth can Allan Bell claim a moral victory, when depositors were misled on the timing of the DCS? The SoA was merely a cover-up job.

  1. (Second page Nick Clegg) "For reasons that were not understood on the island, the FSA stopped communicating one week before the collapse (in contrast to the Bradford and Bingley experience).

So, it's quite obvious that the FSA (in collaboration) with HMG were involved in a major cover-up... at our expense. We were caught in the crossfire. I have no idea how we can get these perpetrator to pay for their crime, but I truly believe that the IOM has a major responsibility vis-a-vis the depositors who, at the end of the day, are innocent victims, paying for the reckless behavior of the "Big Boys." It should be the IOM's duty to get to the bottom of the FSA's silence one week prior to the collapse.


@Swiss. Yes.

  • follow_the_tao
  • 11/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Fri, 14/08/2009 - 03:53

It's a quiet night Swiss. There is myself, Anrigaut and Alandob. Nobody else.

Now what of the rift between HNW and DST?

What are HNW going to do? What are DST going to do? Are they capable of talking together, if not why not?

Now you are the reverse side of Lieben. And there's GB. What exactly is happening?

This current half-cocked progress is a waste of time.

If the p"personalities cannot agree then someone else has to, otherwise we all go home and leave the IoM-gangsters alone.

Do you have two brain cells to rub together? Currently you've lost. You want to up the ante you have to communicate.

I leave it there. You don't respond, you're responsible.


@swiss...right!

  • Lucky Jim
  • 13/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Tue, 11/08/2009 - 09:42

NOW members can see why everyone should have trusted the advice of the DST over the SoA! The IoM is still making capital out of this at the expense of the DAG

It is also failure to trust the advice of the DST over the Ceditors Committee vote that has casued MAJOR complications for the DAG. There's some shocking revelations in the pipeline, but this Forum is NOT the place to reveal all.

Look out today for an interim statement on behalf of the DST


Not sure

  • ItsTheft
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Tue, 11/08/2009 - 10:04

Not that these adverts for the DST are appropriate. Making people feel guilty about not supporting you and bowing in front of you is the policy of fear. Looking at at this another way, because the SoA failed, maybe - just maybe - the IoM Gov put the extra dosh into the DCS; something that had not been planned before the failure of the SoA.

Love the idea of a cliff hanger over the DST Creditors Committee debacle, but again, this is the policy of fear and I hope people will not be swayed by it. I am intrigued by LJ's, almost pathological, hatred for the IoM and the massive number of hours being put in by himself - coupled with the expense of the website etc - when he is not a depositor. It has successfully diverted attention away from the UK Government and their culpability in this which I feel very uncomfortable with.

The inherent secrecy within the DST I also find uncomfortable. The website for example is under a name that occures nowhere else. I may be entirely wrong with all this and my assertions, but something just doesnt sit right.


Secrecy? Guilt?

  • banna
  • 15/10/08 01/03/10
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  • Tue, 11/08/2009 - 11:28

So, 'it's theft', you voted for the SoA? Why feel guilty? Who's criticising you? You had your reasons no doubt - right or wrong. For me the SoA was never a runner and I think pursuit of it cost us all time and money.So what? It's the past and we have to deal with the world as it is.The sooner we all start planning and working for the future the better for all of us.
Which brings me to your second theme: that DST is acting secretly and, the inference is, not in our interests.I am no more active in the DST team than you are, but I think we have to be less judgemental and more trusting of people who are after all unpaid volunteers who are trying to find some ways of all of us recovering our money. I agree with your implied criticism of LJ's posting. It doesn't seem to serve any useful purpose except apparently raise your ire.
Your criticism of DST on the grounds of secrecy are thrown at every group which tries to give leadership. Short of being hard wired into their brains there is little chance of being continuously up to date with their thinking and actions. Unless they have something useful and concrete to say why on earth should they say anything? If they are planning or carrying out action which requires some secrecy to be successful why not let them get on with it? Is it not sometimes better to keep ones cards close to the chest?
Up to now I do not know of any action taken by the DST group which has been detrimental to our interests. That is more than I can say for other groups who have negotiated in secret with parties on IOM which have largely led to our past and present problems. If DST negotiates in secret deals which can be seen not to be in our interests - and I do not believe for one moment that they are or will be doing so - then will be the time to worry about apparent secrecy.
I agree with you that we are not spending enough thought or energy on getting to grips with our main opponent - HMG - but with Parliament in recess it is likely to be less effective before the autumn. And anyway that is going to need a lot of planning and much more coordination than we have at the moment.
My major concern is that we are not acting as a unified group and unless we do so we shall achieve nothing.I put my hope in the proposed new site for depositors only
because that should allow us better to know ourselves and our aims.


Not sure what you are saying?

  • ItsTheft
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Wed, 12/08/2009 - 06:03

I didnt actually vote for the SoA. As i lost over 50K it was all irrelevant anyway..

Trying not to sound overly dramatic, I do not have a future. As I'm about to start being 'awkward' I'll just recap my status;

The £150K i lost was needed at the time and the timing of Mr Darling's ill considered action could not have been more precise; couple of days before and I could have stopped the cheque that the UK bank had sent me when it forcibly closed my account, a day-or-so after and Ozforex would have been paid and I would have my lifes savings in Australia (I had already bought the A$ after KSF assured me the day before that the cheque had cleared and the money was available for payment to Ozforex). The £150K was part of my visa conditions for being in Australia and so no £150K, no legal stay. I would have prefered to keep my money in the UK, but that was not possible due to the UK Governments legislation which made it uneconomical for UK banks to support accounts from non-domiciled people. The inevitable collapse of everything around me started on the 9th of Oct, and was complete by Christmas. Even a full 100% return now would be way too late for me personally. So, no too fine a point on it, I consider that I failed in the original aim I had when helping to get this site off the ground all those months ago (I hasten to add that I take zero credit for this site now and havent done so for many many months now. 'ng' - and stef - must take all credit as many many a long hour has gone into it by them for little credit, but much grief).

So, thats my status. I'll also be clear about where I am going and what I'm doing; I am out for revenge. Simple as that. Pointless it may be. Childish and worrying, probably. Slightly pathological, almost certainly. But i wake thinking it, and go to sleep (largely alcohol induced) thinking it. Except, I do not blame the Isle of Man. They have made some mistakes, and the limited gene-pool there makes them look a little like 'Local Hero', but the mistakes are probably more to do with PR than anything else. Certainly nowhere near the level of mistakes that would constitute the current attempt - led by 'Lucky Jim' - to bring down their economy (which would be a further disaster for all concerned; even those covered by the DCS).

Sorry banna, but i really do think we need to be judgemental. I am not a member of DST nor am I a member of HNW. However, I know who all the folk involved in HNW are and I know what drives them in this crusade; they have a large wad at stake. Despite much digging, I know next to nothing about DST and even less about this 'Lucky Jim' character. I do know what DST have done and I can see the results - much mutual appreciation and backslapping but little positive substance.

Reading every post I can find from 'Lucky Jim'/'Jim For Justice'/'Jim' on the web, the theme is constant - down with the IoM Government. The result is that almost no person, or body, on the IoM will talk to the DST; and they only talk to others (IE. HNW) guardedly for fear of offending and causing more 'DESTROY THE IOM!!' yelling.

'Lucky Jim'/'Jim For Justice'/'Jim' appears to be the prime 'rabble rouser' in the 'DESTROY THE IOM!!' movement. He has spent many many many hours on it. He has been very clever with words (just look at the careful dig at me saying 'pity' i didnt join my video with the other 'DESTROY THE IOM!!' video's while praising me for a good video - very clever psychological manipulation). He has quietly created divisions between us; in an email I received from him (using an email account which had only recently been created) he attacked 'ng' for wanting to charge a small fee for use of this site. He set up another, rival site, when ng refused to kowtow to his bullying (He tried to force ng to remove posts he didnt agree with; interesting, considering his vitriol against the Manxforums site)

DST, as far as I know, have not done anything overtly detrimental (Except their baffling Creditors Committe voting). But they haven't actually helped either. You say banna that "That is more than I can say for other groups who have negotiated in secret with parties on IOM which have largely led to our past and present problems." - By 'other groups' I assume you mean the HNW group. As you yourself say If they are planning or carrying out action which requires some secrecy to be successful why not let them get on with it? Is it not sometimes better to keep ones cards close to the chest? - so i am not sure what point you are trying to make here.

Finally banna; while HMG is in recess is exactly the time that everyone still affected by this should be talking to their MP's and the UK media and filling inboxes as full as they will go.. There is less UK political news in the media at the moment due to Parliament not being in session and so more opportunity for us to make a noise. MP's are concentrating on constituency matters and taking stock of their political positions. And they do care very much what is said about them publicly - there have been 30ish visits to the http://www.ksfiom.com site, since early July, from the 'parliament.gov.uk' network with the average time spent on the site being 18 minutes (dunno what pages they were looking at as Google analytics does show that for a particuar source domain). So to use an excuse for NOT writing, yet again, to MP's is both wrong and playing into their hands (they WANT us to shutup and go away! Unfortunatley that is what we are doing.)

I to would have liked to keep us unified; as proved with the creation of a central website to bring us together. But with so many disparate people thrown together against their will, and considering that the root of all evil (Money!) is/was at stake, it was probably never going to work like that. There was bound to be petty jealousies (he is richer than me, the b***ard), leadership battles (wow, a group of people! I can be a leader), plain old disagreements and simple lying to put emphasis on an argument. Look at my posts for example; I have probably been guilty of almost every one of them; I'm certainly not going to pretent to be 'holier than tho'

But my real (and this makes me very uncomfortable indeed) question with 'Lucky Jim' is, 'Why'? With all of us here, we know exactly what drives us; why we spend hours on this, why we do sometimes end up shouting at each other. Almost none of us want to be here and would happily never speak to any fellow site member again. But with 'Lucky Jim' it is different. Why is he here? Why does he put so many hours (and it is a hell of a lot of hours) into this? Why is he so focused on destroying the Isle of Man? He is not a depositor so why? Am am being increadibly disingenuous here and he really does feel such sympathy for us that he is willing to devote hours each day, and spend his own money, to fighting for us? For no personal gain? For people he doesnt know? After nearly 50 years of knowing the human race, i know people like that are very few and far between. And people like that are usually to be found slumming it helping victims of war or poverty in Africa or Asia.

So. I bluntly ask. Who is Lucky Jim, why does he want to 'help' us and why the stance against the IoM to the detriment of all else? If my gut feeling is wrong then I will unreservedly take it all back and save up to send him an apology/grateful-thanks card..

This is a long and probably rambling post. But there was a lot I needed to get off my mind. And the reply to banna needed a full and proper response.


Thanks for the reply,' Its

  • banna
  • 15/10/08 01/03/10
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  • Thu, 13/08/2009 - 23:34

Thanks for the reply,' Its Theft'
What am I saying?
- don't feel guilty, and I guess from your reply you don't
- ignore LJ, it's the quickest way of silencing him
- give DST the benefit of the doubt
- groups going off their own track have cost us time and money in pursuing the SoA, have resulted in us having to continue to work with a liquidator who will not do the job we need doing, have resulted in a Committee that starts off at odds one wth another,have caused internal squabbling which has prevented us getting organised and focussed - and if we go on un-organised we shall achieve nothing and shall deserve to achieve nothing.
What else?
No event in my life has made me as angry as the initial action taken by HMG and the subsequent contempt they have shown to our plight. I therefore fully understand and share your need for revenge. But I have come to the conclusion that sending off individual letter after individual email will achieve very little. I have a pile more than 12 inches thick of emails and letters, and I do not think we have so much as dented the shells of any of the MPs. As for the Treasury and the FSA they merely stick up 2 fingers to us.
Hence my view that unless and until we get a coordinated plan of campaign that shocks MPs and makes them realise that we do not intend to go away our results will be zero. We have been nice and reasonable and kept the gloves on, and until we start being brutal we make no impact.
This point of view is probably not shared by many among us so I do not have much hope of getting very far.
I have stopped bombarding MP's and others for the time being, and the few recent letters I have written have not even been acknowledged. It is my impression that most of them have gone away on holiday or are preparing the autumn Party Conferences. Getting them to sit up and take notice before Conference season seems pretty unlikely to me.
The number of people who could change HMG policy is very limited. We need to ask ourselves who could change the policy and why would they do so. If we could answer those questions we might develop a plan/campaign that would get us somewhere. But what chance do we have as long as we remain disunited?
I am less worried than you by the attacks on IOM. Their leaders and institutions deserve it. In the initial stages I firmly believe they could have resolved our problems by adopting the right attitudes to the UK Govt and the Life Companies. They chose to try to hoodwink us instead and create a situation in which no investigation of IOM actions/organisations would have been possible. Their reactions to our problem have been no different to the UK reactions. If some people want to take revenge on them I find it difficult to be critical.


Banna, I for one identify

  • IceCrusher
  • 14/10/08 25/10/11
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  • Sat, 15/08/2009 - 08:12

Banna, I for one identify with all you've said here, and feel pretty much the same way.
Ice


I will not stop writing to Uk MPs

  • ItsTheft
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Fri, 14/08/2009 - 09:13

Banna, I do in fact very guilty. Guilty I wrecked a happy family and guilty I went totally doolally afterwards. Thats history.

I ignored Lucky Jim for as long as possible, but I'm afraid his hysterics - hidden behind anonymity - just got too much. If someone is going to make a stand like that then we need to know who they are and what their motives really are.

Again no, I simply cannot give DST the benefit of the doubt anymore. For the same reason and for the reasons in my previous post. There are members of DST who have questionable motives and some of the actions of DST have been bizarre to the point of conspiritorial!

Banna, when you say 'groups' do you mean HNW? If so, i'm really unsure how they have 'cost us money' in pursuing the SoA. Also, again, I am unsure what you are saying about the Liquidator not doing the job that needs doing - he is liquidating, as per his remit.

I have difficulty understanding how (If you do mean HNW) they 'have resulted in a Committee that starts off at odds one wth another,have caused internal squabbling which has prevented us getting organised and focussed'.

Personally, (and this IS a personal view, I speak for no-one else when I say this) I consider the HNW to be a mature coherent bunch who appear more than qualified to be representing me on a Creditors Committee. They do not go round yelling and screaming, throwing out all sorts of threats while patting each other on the back for a job well done and appearing to ego groom.

Banna, again a personal view and because my circumstances will differ from your own, I have to disagree with you that sending out individual letter after individual email will achive very little. I've not got much to base that disagreement on and I'd be the first to say that it seems to have acheived absolutely nothing - except for two things. First, A close friend (DJ on this site; and i'll admit a calming force on me!) received a message via his sister (an agricultural journalist) that a UK MP who is one our side told her that he/she was puzzled by the general lack of correspondance received by his/her collegues concerning this. The MP was speaking to his sister candidly and asked for his/her identity not to be revealed - his sister being a Journo has kept by this promise (and yes, I have tried like hell to find out!). DJ posted this information on this site, but apparently the squabbling quickly drowned it out. Second, I had a similar remark made to be by an MP's PA when she said that '...MP's will not take note of us until they have to. If their seats are put at risk then they tend to act a bit more.'. This is where individuals doing their own thing will help; The Fourth Plinth action is fantastic (and perhaps will supply that 'shock' you want). However, I will NEVER cease the constant flow of emails (I cant afford stamps, so email it has to be) to MP's. The biggest reason to write more rather than less is the Telegraph article by Shearer!! On the basis of that alone MP's should be pushing for an enquiry; IE. Just what WAS said to the IoM, prior to the TSC meeting, that made them change their tune so suddenly and dramatically. Why didnt the UK FSA inform the IoM FSC of what was being prepared to happen so that th IoM treasury could also make arrangements to transfer the retail accounts?

I do not want any policy changed (and, very personally, dont give a stuff about the money anymore; thats lost), I just want Darling to recogise he made a mistake, Pearson to admit he lied in Parliament on the 10th of November and for MP's to acknowledge the harm done to me personally by the actions of the UK Parliament. And no, I dont think it will ever happen; but by God I am not going to give up - That place wrecked my family and nothing (MP's holidays, conference or threats) will stop me until I receive a full and honest apology.

Reason I am worried by the attacks on the Isle of Man is two fold. I simply dont see that they deserve it and I simply dont see how they can resolve it. I also dont say that lightly and have had to eat very large quantities of humble pie in coming to that conclusion. However, it would be churlish of me to be critical of those wishing to 'take revenge' on the IoM as they may well be right and I may very well be wrong - but they need to say that those actions ARE intended to be revenge; not that they are 'intended to get us 100% deposits back'.

Banna, you are probably as bored with this reply as 99.9% of the others who have read this far so I'll start to wind it up! I'll not pretend to agree with you on most of your points, but i'll also not ask you to agree with mine. The last 44 weeks has humbled me in its entirety. I do not stand behind any false hopes or illusions - I failed in my original intention and that's life - but I will not allow people who are in the same boat as me to be misled by people with ulterior motives, who will not even have the decency to say who they are.


so don't stop writing to MPs...

  • banna
  • 15/10/08 01/03/10
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  • Fri, 14/08/2009 - 20:14

Well,Its Theft we seem to be getting quite a dialogue going. I don't know whether anybody else is interested but it seems to help me in my thinking so here comes another reply.
I'm not going to go on commenting on past behaviour of fellow depositors. I've made my views known to some of them, anything I say will change neither the past nor their views, so I prefer to try to think about how we should be acting in the future.
I disagree with your view that PWC is doing the job it should be doing. They are being paid a fortune -unwillingly by me - and I do not regard their job as being merely to collect up the money they can find and then dole it out. Is that worth £500/hour? They should be protecting our interests above all other. Part of that means that they should be fighting our battles for us against the people who contributed to getting us in to this mess. If that means Docherty or the Directors, if that means the FSC - so be it. Have we seen any signs of that happening? Did they advise against the SoA on those grounds?They should be pursuing the parental guarantee problem. Did they advise against the SoA on those grounds? Have we seen any signs of them investigating the issue?They should be protesting at the secrecy order which prevents us knowing what is happening in the UK situation. Any sign of them trying to help us in that? They should not have blindly worked on the SoA without clarifying who would be paying them. I regard that as theft - in the same way that I consider that the UK Treasury stole our deposits.There is a whole active job they should be doing for us, and I do not believe they have the will to do it. And I might add that I doubt their ability too.
As to continuing to write to MPs. Why not? But where has it got us? I know that we have had some good contacts with MPs who would like to be helpful - but we have seen no results from it. Our MP (Tory) has been a waste of space. Perhaps we've tackled him ineffectively?
Perhaps we need to change tack. What about trying to persuade a group of 6 or 8 or more MPs to form a 'pressure group' in the House? If our contacts witih some high level MPs are as good as some say they are that might be a possibility. The first step might be to arrange a meeting in London and get some of them to come and listen to us? I believe it is a forlorn hope to expect an individual MP to take up our case - but a group of them could achieve something. Or if we couldn't persuade them to act as a pressure group could we get a group of them to meet us and advise us how we should go about tackling the authors of our disaster?
Second thought; when an industry/charity wants to influence political thinking/action it sets up a lobby directly at Westminster. How could we do that?
You see, I'm not opposed to trying to get some action taken through MPs - but I no longer believe that individual letters will achieve what we need.
I'm not in your shoes, so I cannot fully understand your reasoning, but I certainly have difficulty in trying to understand why you feel the need to shoulder the guilt that so clearly sits on the shoulders of Darling, the FSA and the Treasury - plus those people in IOM who unthinkingly put 60% of our money in an unprotected position.
Darling could have done what he liked without any impact on us if KSF IOM had not so carelessly put our money in KSF UK. And that is part of the argument for attacking the IOM.


@ItsTheft

  • expatfrance1
  • 15/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Fri, 14/08/2009 - 09:44

Glad to see you are back on this forum and trying to inject some common sense.

I too have been concerned by the comments of LJ who seems to have appointed himself as the propaganda chief for the DAG. Throughout his blogs he claims to be voicing the 'official' message of the DAG but we really only have his word for that and as for his motives, well who knows. It seems to me that in recent months the DAG has been overly influenced by several vociferous individuals who have nothing to loose no matter what the final outcome is and no matter how long that takes.

The DAG message now seems, whether intentially or not, to have moved from '100% return for all' to 'Dont bank in the Isle Of Man' as confirmed by LJ' latest missive when he states, when referring to the Dont bank in the Isle Of Man campaign:-

'Congratulations to those members who are spreading the DAG message'.

How really is this going to help obtain '100% for all'?


DAG's focus

  • ng
  • 11/10/08 31/12/20
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  • Fri, 14/08/2009 - 10:56

One can argue "all publicity is good publicity" in the sense that getting DAG issues in the public eye may help us.

I do wonder if to some people the site at http://www.kaupthingiom-dag.co.uk appears to be the DAG site - not in the small print, but on the front page - showing the DAG logo and title "KAUPTHING IoM
Depositors' Action Group" yet no obvious link to www.ksfiomdepositors.org or this forum site. Such confusion, if indeed it occurs, may not be in DAG's best interests.

Just to confirm, DST manages content on the public site (www.ksfiomdepositors.org) and I think DAG members on the whole are comfortable with that. LJ is not part of DST (though assists them as a researcher).

In summary, whilst the strong anti-IOM campaign my not directly help to achieve 100% return, it might force IOM into taking action (e.g. obtaining a loan from HMG) which they would not otherwise have taken. I think anything is worth trying, so long as it's not clearly contrary to DAG's interests.

Final thought: Hypothetically, if HMG wanted to manipulate DAG in order to move DAG's focus away from HMG/Labour etc, how might they achieve that?


@ng.. the complementary website & myths about LJ

  • Lucky Jim
  • 13/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Fri, 14/08/2009 - 13:07
  1. There seems to be some misunderstanding here about the complementrary website. For the benefit of new members - & those who have been away some time - please see here: http://chat.ksfiomdepositors.org/users/lucky-jim and here http://chat.ksfiomdepositors.org/blog-entry/new-complementary-dag-public... which explains all

  2. My role in the DST Support Group has been far more than that of researcher.

As for my research role other members of the DAG have been very generous with their time in helping me with certain important projects. Our work has been confidential but one day when the story of the DAG is published members will come to see just what a debt of gratitude is owed these lovely & trustworthy members.

  1. as to who I am my bio is on the Chat site here: http://chat.ksfiomdepositors.org/users/lucky-jim
    and especially here on my public blog: http://www.blogger.com/profile/01194121320492050293

I do have a private life outside the DAG & I believe the Forum rules do give me the right to have my privacy respected.

  1. I am sorry to have to disappoint the conspiracy chaps here! I am not a double agent working for MI5 (or MI6). If I were I would have got the sack a long time ago!

  2. I had an e-mail yesterday asking me: "why do you put up with so much sh*t?"
    The answer is in my bio. I also support Liberty, Amnesty & the Human Rights movement & yes, during my career I have done my stint on the rubbish heaps.
    You can't do that for long without getting a hide like a rhino! ( :

  3. My sincere thanks to all those who have written to me in support, both in the present context of defamatory & scurrilous attacks on me, & over the past 10 months. Your kind support & encouragement is greatly appreciated. There's some really wonderful folk in the DAG and it is a privilage to be on the front line with you all.

Jim (for Justice) !


Jim, you have created the confusion

  • ItsTheft
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Fri, 14/08/2009 - 23:19

Why is it that you hide behind anonimity? If you want to protect your anonimity, to put it bluntly, bugger off back to your cosy artistic life in Southern France.

Why is it that you appear hell bent on the destruction of the Isle of Man? I really really do what to know what your motivation is sir.

You have created division. You have created diversion. You are, by your own admission, not a depositor. You make statements with zilcho evidence. And you do have an interesting relationship with westminster - no-one is talking 'MI5/MI6' (another clever diversion) - which kinda ticks boxes that shouldn't be ticked.

We all have to live with our actions over this. As you conveiniently whipped your money out of KSFIoM hours before Westminster acted you do not - you can move on and return to your painting and pleasant life in Le Midi. no matter what the result of your actions are You setup what appears to be a 'rival' website (creating further division) that purports to be representing the DAG - if DAG wish to adopt it then fair play, that is for them to decide and not you. You are asking people (and then condescendingly 'thank' them whne they follow you!) to bring the Isle of Man to its knees. This is ALL while attempting to hide behind a veil of anonimity. Sorry Jim, but I just dont buy it.

[ng: edited for privacy - please don't post members' real names even if that information is publicly visible elsewhere]


Content here is provided by individuals and may not be correct

  • ng
  • 11/10/08 31/12/20
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  • Fri, 14/08/2009 - 18:39

Apologies for referring to you simply as a researcher - it was certainly not meant to belittle your efforts, only to confirm for everyone's benefit that http://www.kaupthingiom-dag.co.uki is not the "official" DST site (as far as I know.) Now re-reading your http://www.kaupthingiom-dag.co.uk/team.htm I see you are listed under the heading Research/Analysis/Support - I have no further information than that.

In the rest of your post you seem to be defending yourself against accusations that have not been made, at least not here (unless I've missed them) - is that because such accusations been made elsewhere? Any examples?

One thing though LJ, please try to stick to facts, and support your claims where possible. Otherwise it's hardly surprising if people begin to question your actions and motivation. I don't claim to be a a perfect poster by any means, but try to use words/phrases like it seems, I wonder, hypothetically and so on, where appropriate. On that note, and with reference to "defamatory & scurrilous attacks on me (LJ)" can you give a few examples please? I am aware that some members have questioned your actions, but I'm not aware of any that have attacked you (again, I may well have missed it if that has indeed occurred.)

To be clear, if somebody said something like "ng is an idiot" then that might be regarded as an attack on me. I might question their judgement, unless of course they could back up their claim with suitable external references and so prove that indeed I were an idiot - that would come as a surprise to me but I am always prepared to consider possibilities that don't match my own filtered perception of reality. On the other hand, if somebody said for example "ng is deliberately feeding exaggerated or misleading information to DAG members" then I would certainly be concerned, and seek examples, provide clarification, etc, but I would not report it as an attack on me. Furthermore, if such a claim were clearly unsubstantiated, then I suspect that any resulting "defamation" would more likely be that of the poster rather than the target of the claim. I'm using myself as an example here, only to avoid any possible misinterpretation as an actual attack on anybody else (sigh).

Just for the record, I am not a secret agent either (but then I would say that, wouldn't I ? ;) Seriously though, LJ, I don't think anybody is attacking you, what they are doing is questioning your motivation and methods. Since as you point out you are think skinned, you can presumably handle that and won't need to email the site administration to complain next time it happens. As it says on the front page, "Content here is provided by individuals and may not be correct".


My mistake!

  • ItsTheft
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Fri, 14/08/2009 - 11:29

That is my mistake then. Now I am confused!! So what is the http://www.kaupthingiom-dag.co.uk site????

I assumed it was the official DST/DAG site! What a mess.


Will the real DAG public site please stand up...

  • ng
  • 11/10/08 31/12/20
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  • Fri, 14/08/2009 - 11:52

Um.. I guess it depends on your interpretation of official! We could put it to a vote? :)


Welcome back Matt, Kind

  • mikepapa
  • 10/10/08 n/a (free)
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  • Thu, 13/08/2009 - 16:10

Welcome back Matt,

Kind regards,

Mike


Welcome back Matt

  • caledonia
  • 14/10/08 30/09/09
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  • Fri, 14/08/2009 - 15:26

As futile as it often seems ..... I continue to write to MP's, MEP's and any other P's I can think of.


welcome back matt

  • jmf
  • 16/10/08 31/10/09
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  • Thu, 13/08/2009 - 20:05

from me too.


Welcome Its Theft

  • glen07
  • 21/10/08 n/a (free)
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  • Thu, 13/08/2009 - 22:00

Good to hear from you.


Thanks

  • ItsTheft
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Fri, 14/08/2009 - 06:30

Thanks guys. And thanks for the many kind emails.

I'll not pretend that I'm glad to be back and things are a little 'different' in my life now, than they were 45 weeks ago.

I apologise if i do not reply to your emails individually but things are still a bit raw and machine time is still quite limited. Time i do get is mostly spent trying to keep up the promise I made to myself of a minimum 100 emails a week to UK MP's. And postings to newspaper comment columns. Although I did waste a day finding out the real identity of the Lucky Jim guy.


Any joy from MP Henry Bellingham, Its Theft?

  • glen07
  • 21/10/08 n/a (free)
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  • Fri, 14/08/2009 - 07:46

Have you contacted MP Henry Bellingham? He apparently has a very close member, who invested with KSFIOM and has tried to rally some interest in this situation.


glen, Henry Bellingham

  • ItsTheft
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Fri, 14/08/2009 - 08:32

I have indeed been communication with Mr Bellingham but havent heard from him for quite a while.

On 23rd Feb i wrote to him:-

.
.
.
1. 2007 UK Money Laundering Legislation caused the banks to stop accepting custom from non-domiciled UK Citizens. The result was that many British people overseas ere forced to use ‘offshore’ banks.
2. The collapse of KSF IoM was caused by the words and actions of Mr Darling on the 8th of October. It was legislation not ratified by parliament and based on an incorrect statement by him (I have used the FOI act to obtain details of correspondance between Mr Darling and the Icelandic chancellor showing this).
.
.
.

Mr Bellingham replied on the 24th (the next day!):-
Thanks.
I am on the case as I have 2 constituents involved, and have asked dozens of questions including these ones.
I will obviously carry on doing all I can, but the difficulty we face is that no government - UK, Isle of Man + Iceland - will commit to anything until the IoM court sorts out the liquidation or SoA. The point being that KSF(IoM) could in theory (although most improbable) be sold as a going concern, and this could in law mean business as usual. So that's why no-one will do anything othe than sit on the fence.
That's why I'm so angry that the court has gone for another adjournment.
Regards.
Henry Bellingham

I've written 3 further emails to Mr Bellingham and received confirmations from his PA but nothing more.


Contacting MP's en masse

  • glen07
  • 21/10/08 n/a (free)
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  • Fri, 14/08/2009 - 22:59

I think there is a suggestion to try and get a group of sympathetic MP's to form a pressure group. No individual MP is willing or effective in forcing an enquiry or continued notice into the KSFIOM mess. Can a standardised letter, which we can also add our own individual stories and circumstances, be created and sent to a group of MP's which we feel have taken some notice in our plight? It is for us all then, to take the time to send a letter/fax/email to them and meet up with them at Westminster. Is this possibly a worthwhile project?


@glen

  • bellyup
  • 10/10/08 09/01/10
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  • Sat, 15/08/2009 - 01:35

I think that this is a good idea there must be one letter about already written that we could adapt.


I agree

  • bellyup
  • 10/10/08 09/01/10
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  • Tue, 11/08/2009 - 10:24

'The inherent secrecy within the DST I also find uncomfortable. The website for example is under a name that occurs nowhere else. I may be entirely wrong with all this and my assertions, but something just doesnt sit right'

Me too.
I have always been concerned about this.
Please can you explain what you mean exactly what you mean about the website?.


bellyup

  • ItsTheft
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Tue, 11/08/2009 - 19:27

This makes me look a right git, but;

Go to this site.

Enter www.kaupthingiom-dag.co.uk and click lookup

The site description is "...don't back on the Isle of Man" - another 'Kill IoM' shout rather than, say, "fighting for 100% return of depositors money".

If you scroll down, you'll see that the registrant is named but that further details have been 'omitted from the WHOIS service'. When setting up a website domain name, you must consciously opt to have your details omitted from the whois system as the registrant will have to forward - using snail mail - network related correspondance.

[ng: edited for privacy - please do not post names of other users here, even if available publicly elsewhere]


Webmaster on www.kaupthingiom-dag.co.uk

  • glen07
  • 21/10/08 n/a (free)
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  • Fri, 14/08/2009 - 03:17

Notice webmaster of this site, when highlighted, moves to an email to: from-jim(?)hotmail [dot] com. Is this you, LJ?


Another question for Webmaster on www.kaupthingiom-dag.co.uk

  • ItsTheft
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Fri, 14/08/2009 - 07:45

Another question I'd ask of 'Jim' (Sorry, not his real name but he orders ng to remove any posts referring to it, even tho it is in the public domain) is how the 4517 figure is derived?

A sentence containing the words 'Hard Coded' will probably be forthcoming. It certainly does not come from 'w3c', as it appears.