Questions for Mike Simpson for call on 23rd February 2009

  • frog
  • 10/10/08 13/09/09
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Posted: Tue, 10/02/2009 - 11:42

Hello everyone,

Please use this tread for questions you would like to be put to Mike Simpson on the 23rd February.

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Have Simpsons answers from 23.2 been published ?

  • BustedFlat
  • 20/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Tue, 24/02/2009 - 09:30

Have Simpsons answers from 23.2 been published on this site yet ?


MS answers - 23.2.09 published here

  • columbgc
  • 11/10/08 14/07/10
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Mike Simpson call

  • maxsweep
  • 15/11/08 31/05/09
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  • Tue, 24/02/2009 - 15:31

I was also wondering if anything had been published as yet. I have been checking but thought I had perhaps missed the thread somewhere.


Mike Simpson call

  • tsunamivictim
  • 11/10/08 n/a (free)
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  • Wed, 25/02/2009 - 01:46

I can't find this either? Is it a new thread?
Can anyone please direct me to where the answers are. Thanks


Question to Mike Simpson

  • Mike
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Mon, 23/02/2009 - 15:44

Frog

Maybe this is too late, although this question may also have been put to Mike Simpson previously. But during the UK Treasury Committee Hearing, when John Aspden was asked about the status of the £550 million transferred from KSF Isle of Man to the UK branch, he mentioned he had received a 2 page email the previous Friday from, I believe, the FSA.
Since the UK Treasury Committee Hearing was nearly 3 weeks ago, has Mike Simpson discussed the details of the email and now has a better understanding of situation regarding funds in the UK?


In flight funds

  • Olivia 93
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
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  • Mon, 23/02/2009 - 07:24

Hi there

Can anyone advise why, when the banking licence wasnt suspended till the 8th October this stopped in flight funds initiated on the 6th and 7th October from proceeding to their final destination?

Many thanks


Some iniiated on the 6th....

  • Anonymous
  • Offline
  • Mon, 23/02/2009 - 08:37

...arrived - appears to have been pot-luck and/or the method of transfer (BACS, Swift, etc.)


It wasn't the banks licence

  • skintagainnow
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Mon, 23/02/2009 - 08:04

It wasn't the banks licence that stopped them - some were held up in KSF UK others were caught by the anti-tip off and clearing houses under orders not to clear Icelandic assets - hence they were not forwarded to the destination accounts - held in the UK seized by E&Y and PWC is trying to return to IoM. Well a % of them, same % as the rest of the returned IoM deposit.


two questions

  • adrienne
  • 10/10/08 13/05/10
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  • Sun, 22/02/2009 - 15:47

hi

  1. can we ask for exact amount of in-flight funds which were in the UK before being returned
  2. can we get sight of the in-flight legal opinion he obtained some months back

What question and what answer ?

  • steelwood
  • 24/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Sun, 22/02/2009 - 15:42

What questions and what answers, what benefits to the depositors from this pratice ?


UK Statutory Instrument (SI) 1674 (2008) & Duties of KFSUK Admin

  • Wombat761
  • 30/01/09 20/03/15
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  • Sun, 22/02/2009 - 13:03

UK Statutory Instrument (SI) 1674 (2008) & Duties of KFSUK Administrator (E&Y)

SI-1674 gives E&Y 6 months ( the “transitional period” ) in which to complete two transfers comprising the “Overriding Objectives” [ORO – SI Art 21(2) ] . The two transfers were to result in ING becoming banker for former UK “Edge” depositors . On Feb 9th 2009 ING announced that the relevant transfers were complete [http://www.ingdirect.co.uk/kaupthingedge.asp] .

Q1. Does this imply that the KFSUK Administrator (E&Y) is now at liberty to perform its other duties in administration, and thereby enable KFSIOM to make application for transfer of Depositor funds?

The UKFSCS announced on 23 January [http://www.fscs.org.uk/consumer/] that it had completed compensation payments to 1000 KFSUK ordinary (non-Edge) depositors, but that it had discovered there seemed to be 7000 more! To the extent that UK FSC refunds ordinary and Edge depositors it becomes a creditor of KFSUK [SI #1674 Art 16]

SI -1674 Art 27(1) provides that during the “transitional period” (ie for 6 months from 8/10/2008) there were to be no other payments or disposals with UK Treasury Consent, and any such shall be deemed “null & void”. SI-1674 Art 27(2) says that no “RELATED PARTY” may exercise any right of set-off or combination of accounts (whatever that is).. in relation to debts owed by KFSUK without Treasury Consent. Para 27(3) defines a related party as any member of the Kaupthing Group that is NOT A SUBSIDIARY.

Q2. Is KFSIOM a subsidiary of KFSUK? [ It is noted that Aiden Doherty in his first Affidavit refers to them as “Sister” companies, yet Tony Shearer in his evidence to the TC in Parliament states that in Singer & Friedlander times, what is now KFSIOM was a subsidiary of what is now KFSUK!

If KFSIOM were in law a subsidiary of KFSUK, then SI-1674 Art 27(3) plus SI-1674 Art 27( 2) appears to allow KFSUK to pay debts owed to KFSIOM without reference to the UK Treasury!

Q3. Does this provide a “loophole “ for Mr. Simpson to make application for repayment of the depositor funds held by KFSUK?

Q4. Given the apparent fulfilment of the SI-1674-stated “Overriding Objectives” on February 9th (according to ING), is the UK Administrator now at liberty to consider dealing with the KFSIOM Depositor Funds? OR

Q5 (a) Does E&Y have to apply to the Treasury for permission to continue normal administration of KFSUK and the payment of creditors now that the ING -transactions appear complete?

Or must they wait for the lapse of 6 months willy-nilly?

AND

Q5 (b) May the Liquidators Provisional of KFSIOM, make any such application and are they considering any?

Q6 Can Mr. Simpson, as Liq Prov KFSIOM get a response from KFSUK to the effect of what is the likely time-line to completion now that the ING ORO appears complete?

Q7 General: Assuming E&Y are at liberty to proceed with the ordinary administration of KFSUK, could the shareholders of Kaupthing HF-Holdings UK claim priority over KFSIOM depositors?


APPLICATION OF STATUTORY INSTRUMENT 1674

  • TERENCE STEVENS
  • 30/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Mon, 23/02/2009 - 21:36

Wombat
I think the general theme of your questions is in a very key area. Having listened to Mike Simpsons briefing today I add comments below:
Q1. SI -1674 Art 27(1) provides that during the “transitional period” (ie for 6 months from 8/10/2008) there were to be no other payments or disposals with UK Treasury Consent, and any such shall be deemed “null & void”. SI-1674 Art 27(2) says that no “RELATED PARTY” may exercise any right of set-off or combination of accounts (whatever that is).. in relation to debts owed by KFSUK without Treasury Consent. Para 27(3) defines a related party as any member of the Kaupthing Group that is NOT A SUBSIDIARY.
Was answered by Mike to the effect that Article 27 was aimed at Iceland withdrawing money. He said that there would not be a problem with KSFIOM, or so I think I heard. I thought originally that it was aimed ats KSFIOM. It could have been as part of the Law of Unintended Consequeces, though from ministers utterances and the fact that Pearson said on 6th Nov that KSFIOM must stand in line behind other creditors ( notably including a Cats Charitity according to the Manx Herald) I am not sure how Unintentional that was.
Q2. Is KFSIOM a subsidiary of KFSUK? [ It is noted that Aiden Doherty in his first Affidavit refers to them as “Sister” companies, yet Tony Shearer in his evidence to the TC in Parliament states that in Singer & Friedlander times, what is now KFSIOM was a subsidiary of what is now KFSUK!
If KFSIOM were in law a subsidiary of KFSUK, then SI-1674 Art 27(3) plus SI-1674 Art 27( 2) appears to allow KFSUK to pay debts owed to KFSIOM without reference to the UK Treasury!
I think that this was answerd in that in that KSFIOM is a wholly owned subsidiary of Kaupthing Holdings, which in turn is a wholly owned subsidiary of Kaupthing hf. So in this sense both companies are “sisters”
Q3. Does this provide a “loophole “ for Mr. Simpson to make application for repayment of the depositor funds held by KFSUK?
So probably not. But nice try.

Q4. Given the apparent fulfilment of the SI-1674-stated “Overriding Objectives” on February 9th (according to ING), is the UK Administrator now at liberty to consider dealing with the KFSIOM Depositor Funds? OR
Seems we are just waiting for them to come up with something, the rest as to what exactly is going on is behind closed doors, according to Mike S. But I would have thought this speecific point needs to be made again – maybe next briefing
Q5 (a) Does E&Y have to apply to the Treasury for permission to continue normal administration of KFSUK and the payment of creditors now that the ING -transactions appear complete?
Or must they wait for the lapse of 6 months willy-nilly?
Did not see an answer to that. But as it stands we must wait for them to come back to us, although this is worth raising again
AND
Q5 (b) May the Liquidators Provisional of KFSIOM, make any such application and are they considering any? All these answered above I think.
Q6 Can Mr. Simpson, as Liq Prov KFSIOM get a response from KFSUK to the effect of what is the likely time-line to completion now that the ING ORO appears complete?
Q7 General: Assuming E&Y are at liberty to proceed with the ordinary administration of KFSUK, could the shareholders of Kaupthing HF-Holdings UK claim priority over KFSIOM depositors?
General comment

I think that focus on these basic areas is a good thing and the more the better. The Transfer Order is one of the most undemocratic form of “legalised expropriation” that has ever been placed before and given the nod by parliament. The real history of this so called legal action goes back to the Banking Special Provisions Act which completed its passage through parliament in February 21st 2008. It was ostensibly bulldozed through on the back of the need to legislate for the nationalisation of Northern Rock. But Darling said then that the Act contained more “general provisions” for other circumstances. Although the Conservatives opposed the bill on ethical grounds (correctly) the general provisions which enabled HMG to seize and liquidate KSFUK were never debated. The big issue which was before lawyers, is notwithstanding this, did the Treasury act illegally or not when it seized KSFUK?. I have not seen a real answer to this yet.


Call-in details for Monday 23rd Feb call at 4pm GMT

  • frog
  • 10/10/08 13/09/09
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  • Sat, 21/02/2009 - 00:00

Dear all.

Here are the call-in details from PWC:

Telephone conference dial in details
Following discussions with the Depositors Action Group I have set up a fifth conference call which will take place on Monday 23 February 2009 4:00 pm GMT.

I am making the access details generally available to depositors. If you wish to listen to the call, you will need to register in advance. Please click the link to register.

https://cossprereg.btci.com/prereg/key.process?key=PYYLYQ7NK

Participation will be on a listen only basis. The facility is provided by a third party and accordingly there is a cost per head for usage. Should any party register and then not attend the liquidation will be charged.

The number of lines is limited and I would request that only those depositors who are able to make the call register as we will make the audio recording of the call available on the website for those of you who are unable to attend. Should depositors choose this route to listen, it will significantly reduce the costs. The audio recording from the previous call on 9 February 2009 has now been made available on the KSFIOM website.


Final list of questions for Mike Simpson - call on 23r Feb 2009

  • frog
  • 10/10/08 13/09/09
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  • Fri, 20/02/2009 - 23:53

General Questions

  1. What is the current cash balance for the bank?

  2. How much interest has been earned so far?

  3. Any news about the KSFUK deposit from E&Y?

  4. What is the latest status on the sale of the loan book and any other interest in the purchase of the bank?

Open Questions

  1. Can we have a breakdown of the type and quantity of individual depositors/entities?

  2. Can we have a breakdown of the balance sheet in multicurrency (£, $ and Euro)

This Week’s Questions
1. I understand that it is the intention of LP/MS to discontinue online access to our [frozen] accounts at the end of this month - Febuary 2009.
In view of the recent decision of the IoM Deemster, could you please ask MS to leave this service in place until SoA or Liquidation is decided by the Court?
2. Did KSFIOM have a Directors and Officers Policy. Please can we have a copy and can you tell us whom the policy is with. I believe as a depositor they are obliged to give this information if requested.
3. Can you confirm that one of the four eyes was present on the island at all times in the 6 months prior to October 8th? Were they ever both off the island at the same time?
4. You have spoken to the Kaupthing Resolution committee and stated that there is little chance of a payout under the parental guarantee. It now seems that German depositors are going to receive at least a substantial proportion of their money and the Dutch are getting it all back. What are the differences between the German situation and ours? Do all creditors not rank equally with regard to any distribution from Kaupthing Resolution committee?
5. What on average does liquidation costs the creditors in percentage terms and how long it will take to pay out £50k compared to SOA. I know they will be averages but the depositors can then see exactly when we will get our money back and how much will be received over and above £50k
6. There has been mention of a provisional liquidation creditors’ committee – do you have any more details about this such as the rules and composition etc? How members of DAG can be assured a spot on the creditors' committee. After reading Skandia's latest release, it seems as though they already have their spot.
7. Who were the auditors of KSF? This business was contingent upon a parental guarantee being in place. The auditors must have signed off the accounts on the basis that this guarantee was valid and legally enforceable otherwise it might not have been a going concern. or did the auditors place reliance on the FSC's opinion as to guarantees? Were any of KSF accounts qualified by the auditors or were they all "clean"?
8. Assuming EPS2 goes ahead based on exchange rates at 8Oct08 as EPS1, foreign currency depositors who are in the fortunate position of having less than the equivalent of GBP10k owing, will be paid-up. However if the DCS or SOA is subsequently based on a later date for exchange rates, would they be entitled to a balancing payment from the Liquidator/Scheme Manager?
9. Could the LP please give one or preferably both of the following:
Ignoring all risk of bad debt what is the current basic Net Present Value (NPV) of the Loan Book (i.e. the sum of all the cash flows due back to KSFIOM from borrowers until the loan book has been fully run down)? What discounting curve (i.e. Libor) does the LP use for said estimation?
Please summarise the cash flows due by month and year (rather than just by year) on the Loan Book until it is run-down.
10. As we have with our personal current accounts, etc, would it be possible to have a 'Statement of Account' for KSFIOM, at each of these discussions, to give us an idea of the ongoing state of affairs.
11. In your affidavit re PWC/KSFIOM costs incurred for 'assistance' to IOMG and Alix Partners in preparation of their revised SoA. How much and when does MS expect to 'bill' them for 'PWC/KSFIOM' work that was associated with the S0A preparation. IOMG said that they would bear all costs involved in this
12. What is the nature of the alleged "set-off" against the debt of KSFUK to KSFIOM shown against "Balances with KSFUK" under intergroup business?

  1. Could you tell us to whom you speaks (or e-mails) in the UK Financial Services Authority? How senior is this person? Do you know if this person is the one who spoke to the IOM FSC regarding the transfer of £550,000,000? If you don't know this, could you contact the person and ask him? If the person says "not me" could you ask for the name of the person involved? If the person says he can not disclose the name, would you please ask "and why not?"
  2. How many depositors and how many accounts have balances of less than 10k. What percentage of depositors will have been paid in full having taken the revised EPS?
  3. As HMG has targeted E&Y with working exclusively on the transfer of depositors accounts to ING for the first 6 months of the administration process does the LP know if HMG will be paying all the costs of administration for this 6 month period?
  4. With regard to suing the FSC, have you taken advice on this? 
 Can they be directly sued?
  5. The issue of in-flight court action was raised again recently. If I understand the cases correctly if they were successful then the money would effectively come from funds KSFUK owes to KSFIOM (but as secured creditor). This would reduce the total deposits in KSFIOM whilst reducing our exposure to KSFUK. This would mean that it is in all our interests for the in-flight case to win. If this is the case can Mike Simpson confirm if he would reconsider his earlier decisions on the issue of in-flight and even support the case against KSFUK and RBS? As the legal opinion you received on this will be paid out of the depositors’ funds, it is reasonable to ask you to share that advice with us.
  6. We understand that you, as Liquidator provisionally are still not allowed to see the sealed Orders of the Court on 8 October. Can you still not tell us why your hands are being tied? Can you tell us whether you has asked WHY it was considered necessary to seal the orders and WHO in the Treasury asked for them to be sealed?
  7. Multipart question:
    a) KSFIOM is a company wholly owned by Kaupthing Holdings (IOM) Limited, situated at the same address Yes/No
    b) K Holdings is a company wholly owned by Kaupthing Bank hf, Borgatun 19, 105 Reykjavik, Iceland, Yes/No
    c) Kaupthing Bank hf is therefore a creditor of KSFIOM to the tune of £10,000,000 Yes/No
    d) If c is the case, then will this amount be offset against the Kaupthing hf Parental Guarantee, making K hf just a debtor to KSFIOM
  8. Is it legally possible to swap our frozen deposit for part of KSFUK loan book, and if so, is there any benefit of doing so?

23 Feb questions for Mike Simpson

  • TERENCE STEVENS
  • 30/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
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  • Mon, 23/02/2009 - 08:29

Frog. An excellent job in organsing tthe questions.

I was away until late Sunday evening. I would like to include the following as development to General Question 3 if possible:

3A When do we expect to hear from EW on the state of our assets?

3B Can Mike tell us what he knows about the composition of those assets ? A breakdown of the £557m including interest earned would be most helpful.

3C If the ranking in creditor proirity could somehow be changed in KSFLtd, is the whole bank solution still a possibility or not?


Dear Frog, Is there any

  • mikepapa
  • 10/10/08 n/a (free)
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  • Sat, 21/02/2009 - 14:49

Dear Frog,

Is there any reason the simple question below, requested yesterday, has been left off the list?

Kind Rgds

............................................................................................................................................................................

Thanks Frog,

I understand that it is the intention of LP/MS to discontinue online access to our [frozen] accounts at the end of this month - Febuary 2009.
In view of the recent decision of the IoM Deemster, could you please ask MS to leave this service in place until SoA or Liquidation is decided by the Court?

Kind regards,

Mike


Look at Question 1 of new

  • frog
  • 10/10/08 13/09/09
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  • Sat, 21/02/2009 - 17:25

Look at Question 1 of new questions.


Dear Frog, Many thanks, great

  • mikepapa
  • 10/10/08 n/a (free)
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  • Tue, 24/02/2009 - 00:43

Dear Frog,

Many thanks, great job!

Kind rgds,

Mike


Further questions for LP

  • iainb
  • 11/10/08 01/02/10
  • a depositor
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  • Sat, 21/02/2009 - 12:18

Could you pl add these to list

In his judgement after the court hearing on 19 Feb the Depury Deemster said

“there is no doubt that claims against third parties in this particular case will assume significant importance. It is likely that there may well be claims against regulators, other governmental bodies, possibly directors”

The LP is an officer of the court with powers of investigation under section 206 and 207. Indeed he can go back to the court to ask for more powers if necessary
There seems to be prima facie evidence that (for example) the FSC and the bank directors failed to take due care when allowing KSFIOM funds to be upstreamed to KSFUK.

My question is: what plans does the LP have to investigate this with a view to bringing legal action for redress?

Later in his judgement, the DD said “ this does, as currently advised, appear to be one of those cases where fraud is unlikely to be an issue”.

Does the LP know who has advised him of this?

Does he know if an investigation has been carried out? If so could he share the results of the investigation with depositors. If not could he make enquiries?

Has the LP considered asking the IOM constabularly to rule out any criminal activity


Questions - Still time to add more....

  • frog
  • 10/10/08 13/09/09
  • a depositor
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  • Fri, 20/02/2009 - 16:18

Dear all,

Here is the current list of questions that I've collated from your inputs. Please review and add any additional questions before I send them off later this evening.

Regards

Frog

General Questions

  1. What is the current cash balance for the bank?

  2. How much interest has been earned so far?

  3. Any news about the KSFUK deposit from E&Y?

  4. What is the latest status on the sale of the loan book and any other interest in the purchase of the bank?

Open Questions

  1. Can we have a breakdown of the type and quantity of individual depositors/entities?

  2. Can we have a breakdown of the balance sheet in multicurrency (£, $ and Euro)
    This Week’s Questions

  3. Did KSFIOM have a Directors and Officers Policy. Please can we have a copy and can you tell us whom the policy is with. I believe as a depositor they are obliged to give this information if requested.

  4. Can you confirm that one of the four eyes was present on the island at all times in the 6 months prior to October 8th? Were they ever both off the island at the same time?
  5. You have spoken to the Kaupthing Resolution committee and stated that there is little chance of a payout under the parental guarantee. It now seems that German depositors are going to receive at least a substantial proportion of their money and the Dutch are getting it all back. What are the differences between the German situation and ours? Do all creditors not rank equally with regard to any distribution from Kaupthing Resolution committee?
  6. What on average does a liquidation costs the creditors in percentage terms and how long it will take to pay out £50k compared to SOA. I know they will be averages but the depositors can then see exactly when we will get our money back and how much will be received over and above £50k
  7. There has been mention of a provisional liquidation creditors’ committee – do you have any more details about this such as the rules and composition etc?
  8. Who were the auditors of KSF?This business was contingent upon a parental guarantee being in place. The auditors must have signed off the accounts on the basis that this guarantee was valid and legally enforceable otherwise it might not have been a going concern. or did the auditors place reliance on the FSC's opinion as to guarantees? Were any of KSF accounts qualified by the auditors or were they all "clean"?
  9. Assuming EPS2 goes ahead based on exchange rates at 8Oct08 as EPS1, foreign currency depositors who are in the fortunate position of having less than the equivalent of GBP10k owing, will be paid-up. However if the DCS or SOA is subsequently based on a later date for exchange rates, would they be entitled to a balancing payment from the Liquidator/Scheme Manager?
  10. Could the LP please give one or preferably both of the following :
    Ignoring all risk of bad debt what is the current basic Net Present Value (NPV) of the Loan Book (i.e. the sum of all the cashflows due back to KSFIOM from borrowers until the loan book has been fully run down) ? What discounting curve (i.e. Libor) does the LP use for said estimation ?
    Please summarise the cashflows due by month and year (rather than just by year) on the Loan Book until it is run-down.
  11. As we have with our personal current accts, etc, would it be possible to have a 'Statement of Account' for KSFIOM, at each of these discussions, to give us an idea of the ongoing state of affairs.
  12. In your affadavit re PWC/KSFIOM costs incurred for 'asisstance' to IOMG and Alix Partners in preparation of their revised SoA. How much and when does MS expect to 'bill' them for 'PWC/KSFIOM' work that was associated with the S0A preparation. IOMG said that they would bear all costs involved in this
  13. What is the nature of the alleged "set-off" against the debt of KSFUK to KSFIOM shown against "Balances with KSFUK" under Intergroup business?

  14. Could you tell us to whom you speaks (or e-mails) in the UK Financial Services Authority? How senior is this person ? Do you know if this person is the one who spoke to the IOM FSC regarding the transfer of £550,000,000? If you don't know this, could you contact the person and ask him? If the person says "not me" could you ask for the name of the person involved? If the person says he can not disclose the name, would you please ask "and why not?"

  15. How many depositors and how many accounts have balances of less than 10k. What percentage of depositors will have been paid in full having taken the revised EPS?
  16. As HMG has targeted E&Y with working exclusively on the transfer of depositors accounts to ING for the first 6 months of the administration process does the LP know if HMG will be paying all the costs of administration for this 6 month period?
  17. With regard to suing the FSC; Has you taken advice on this?
 Can they be directly sued?
  18. The issue of inflight court action was raised again recently. If I understand the cases correctly if they were sucessful then the money would effectively come from funds KSFUK owes to KSFIOM (but as secured creditor). This would reduce the total deposits in KSFIOM whilst reducing our exposure to KSFUK. This would mean that it is in all our interests for the inflight case to win. If this is the case can Mike Simpson confirm if he would reconsider his earlier decisions on the issue of in-flight and even support the case against KSFUK and RBS?
  19. We understand that you, as Liquidator provisionally are still not allowed to see the sealed Orders of the Court on 8 October. Can you still not tell us why your hands are being tied ? Can you tell us whether you has asked WHY it was considered necessary to seal the orders and WHO in the Treasury asked for them to be sealed?
  20. Multipart question:
    a) KSFIOM is a company wholly owned by Kaupthing Holdings (IOM) Limited, situated at the same address Yes/No
    b) K Holdings is a company wholly owned by Kaupthing Bank hf, Borgatun 19, 105 Reykjavik, Iceland, Yes/No
    c) Kaupthing Bank hf is therefore a creditor of KSFIOM to the tune of £10,000,000 Yes/No
    d) If c is the case, then will this amount be offset against the Kaupthing hf Parental Guarantee, making K hf just a debtor to KSFIOM
  21. Is it legally possible to swap our frozen deposit for part of KSFUK loan book, and if so, is there any benefit of doing so?

@FROG, LP Question

  • Hampnew
  • 22/01/09 31/05/09
  • not prepared to answer
  • Offline
  • Mon, 23/02/2009 - 07:38

Who was in charge of Compliance at KSF?
Did the Compliance officer advise the board to sanction the transfer to UK without any ring fencing?
Is the Compliance Officer still helping LP?
If not, why not?
Does KSF insurance policy cover the Compliance officer?


Thanks Frog,

  • mikepapa
  • 10/10/08 n/a (free)
  • a depositor
  • Offline
  • Fri, 20/02/2009 - 20:46

Thanks Frog,

I understand that it is the intention of LP/MS to discontinue online access to our [frozen] accounts at the end of this month - Febuary 2009.
In view of the recent decision of the IoM Deemster, could you please ask MS to leave this service in place until SoA or Liquidation is decided by the Court?

Kind regards,

Mike


creditors' committee

  • chd
  • 13/10/08 30/09/09
  • a depositor
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  • Fri, 20/02/2009 - 18:56

Just to reiterate and stress importance of open question no 7. How members of DAG can be assured a spot on the creditors' committee. After reading Skandia's latest release, it seems as though they already have their spot. I'm really worried that IOM will do everything to leave us out. It's really vital that we are represented.

Thanks for great job.


Bank staff for next 6 weeks

  • Codpeace
  • 23/10/08 30/11/12
  • unspecified
  • Offline
  • Fri, 20/02/2009 - 15:15

Can you please ask if he will now be laying off some of the 35 employees in view of the additional delay. I cannot see that they are all needed.


Policy?

  • tsunamivictim
  • 11/10/08 n/a (free)
  • a depositor
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  • Fri, 20/02/2009 - 14:02

Did they have a Directors and Officers Policy . I believe REgulations require this). Please can we have a copy and can you tell us who the policy is with. I believe as a depositor they are obliged to give this information if requested.


D&O policy

  • Anonymous
  • Offline
  • Fri, 20/02/2009 - 14:51

The FSC have said that the bank did not require this as it only came in with the regulations introduced in January this year.. someone has posted this before.. recently I think..
BUT this doesn't mean they didn't have one.. One would have expected some of their larger customers to have made it a requirement.. One important point to ask MS is whether he considers the policy (if there is one) to have been compromised. This MAY be the case if the directors followed "instructions" from the FSC.


4 eyes question

  • tsunamivictim
  • 11/10/08 n/a (free)
  • a depositor
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  • Fri, 20/02/2009 - 13:58

Can he confirm that one of the four eyes was present on the island at all times in the 6 months prior to October 8th. Were they ever both off the island at the same time?


Kaupthing Hf

  • vikingvictim
  • 11/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
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  • Fri, 20/02/2009 - 11:54

MS has spoken to the Kaupthing Resolution committe and stated that there is little chance of a payout under the parental guarentee. It now seems that German depositors are going to receive at least a substantial proportion of there money. What are the differences between the German situation and ours. Do all creditors not rank equally with regard to any distribution from Kaupthing Resolution committee?


Liquidation costs

  • dave
  • 14/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
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  • Fri, 20/02/2009 - 08:53

In view of the opinions of many to go down liquidation route please ask LP what on average a liquidation costs the creditors in percentage terms and how long it will take to pay out £50k compared to SOA. I know they will be averages but the depositors can then see exactly when we will get our money back and how much will be received over and above £50k


Creditor Ctte Rules

  • Alastair
  • 10/10/08 30/09/09
  • a depositor
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  • Thu, 19/02/2009 - 18:40

Frog have we asked for these if not can we. Including composition and elections.


Auditors? Question for LP.

  • Hampnew
  • 22/01/09 31/05/09
  • not prepared to answer
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  • Thu, 19/02/2009 - 17:49

Who were the auditors of KSF?

This business was contingent upon a parental guarantee being in place. The auditors must have signed off the accounts on the basis that this guarantee was valid and legally enforceable otherwise it might not have been a going concern?

Or did the auditors place reliance on the FSC's opinion as to guarantees?

Were any of KSF accounts qualified by the auditors or were they all "clean".?


EPS 2 and Foreign currency accounts

  • Anonymous
  • Offline
  • Thu, 19/02/2009 - 17:33

Assuming EPS2 goes ahead based on exchange rates at 8Oct08 as EPS1, foreign currency depositors who are in the fortunate position of having less than the equivalent of GBP10k owing, will be paid-up. However if the DCS or SOA is subsequently based on a later date for exchange rates, would they be entitled to a balancing payment from the Liquidator/Scheme Manager?


Basic Loan Book Value

  • BustedFlat
  • 20/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
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  • Thu, 19/02/2009 - 16:30

Could the LP please give one or preferably both of the following :

  1. Ignoring all risk of bad debt what is the current basic Net Present Value (NPV) of the Loan Book (i.e. the sum of all the cashflows due back to KSFIOM from borrowers until the loan book has been fully run down) ? What discounting curve (i.e. Libor) does the LP use for said estimation ?

  2. Please summarise the cashflows due by month and year (rather than just by year) on the Loan Book until it is run-down.

(
Since the LP has already indicated the yearly cashflows due it should be childs play to demonstrate this figure, even if it's only based on monthly summarised flows. Knowing the NPV will demonstrate to depositors the maximum value, ignoring bad debt etc. Owning a 400m loan book is clearly not the same as owning 400m in cash and the NPV gives a value which discounts future cashflows.
)


Statement

  • Tricky Dicky
  • 24/10/08 30/05/09
  • a depositor
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  • Thu, 19/02/2009 - 10:42

Hi frog,
As we have with our personal current accts, etc, would it be possible to have a 'Statement of Account' for KSFIOM, at each of these discussions, to give us an idea of the ongoing state of affairs.

Not sure if this has been asked, but it came up in MS affadavit re PWC/KSFIOM costs incurred for 'asisstance' to IOMG and Alix Partners in preparation of their revised SoA. How much and when does MS expect to 'bill' them for 'PWC/KSFIOM' work that was associated with the S0A preparation. IOMG said that they would bear all costs involved in this


Deposits in the main foreign currencies

  • Jerome.broke-in...
  • 14/10/08 14/07/09
  • a depositor
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  • Thu, 19/02/2009 - 06:23

What is the total of deposits in the main foreign currencies including but not limited to
US$
Euro
¥en
I no not think that this question has been asked.


Deposits in foreign currencies

  • rapata
  • 13/10/08 03/08/09
  • a depositor
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  • Thu, 19/02/2009 - 17:53

I have tried on the last 2 calls to have this question included, there was a similar question on the last call and MS replied that the information would be posted on the Web site at the appropriate time.
Frog, please could you put this question as asked above again.


DRAFT BALANCE SHEET 9/10/2008 Q2

  • Wombat761
  • 30/01/09 20/03/15
  • a depositor
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  • Thu, 19/02/2009 - 05:15

What was the time frame within which the Lst550m deposit was paid from KSFIOM to KSFUK? The precise date should be in the accounts. If it was within a certain period of months (6 or 12 depending on jurisdiction) , and established to be for the purpose of evading creditors (by Directors or shareholders in KSFIOM) when it became apparent that KSFIOM was heading for insolvency , then it may be voidable as a fraudulant preference by the court supervising the liquidation, should this go ahead?

The balance sheet in the CEO's (Aiden Doherty) Affidavit dated 30/9/2008 shows the amount to have been transferred at or prior to 30/9/2008.


This is a good question

  • steveservaes
  • 13/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
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  • Thu, 19/02/2009 - 09:25

How long has the FSA in England been preparing their sting?
When did they know Kaupthing was going to go/ be taken down by Darling?
Cos the point is - if it was weeks or months before it happened, they have been complicit in quite the opposite of their statutory role!
That is : instead of protecting the public from dodgy banks etc, they have deliberately allowed deposits into KSFUK in order to freeze them and maximise the pot for Darling to compensate himself with for his bail-out of the UK retail depositors.
Now that my friends is a scandal whichever way you look at it - the FSA deliberately suckering in innocent wholesale depositors knowing a sting was about to take place.
They should be compelled to repay everything paid into KSFUK from the moment FSA should have told the world it was doomed.


Simpson Draft Balance Sheet 9/10/2008 Q1

  • Wombat761
  • 30/01/09 20/03/15
  • a depositor
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  • Thu, 19/02/2009 - 05:01

What is the nature of the alleged "set-off" against the debt of KSFUK to KSFIOM shown against "Balances with KSFUK" under Intergroup business?


Q for Mike Simpson

  • Lucky Jim
  • 13/10/08 31/05/09
  • not a depositor
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  • Wed, 18/02/2009 - 21:49

Could he tell us to whom he speaks (or e-mails) in the UK Financial Services Authority? How senior is this person ?

Does he know if this person is the one who spoke to the IOM FSC regarding the transfer of £550,000,000? If he doesn't know this, could he contact the person and ask him? If the person says "not me" could he ask for the name of the person involved?

If the person says he can not disclose the name, would he please ask "and why not?"


less than 10k

  • insameboat
  • 12/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
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  • Wed, 18/02/2009 - 15:32

Has the question been asked?

How many depositors and how many accounts have balances of less than 10k. What percentage of depositors will have been paid in full having taken the revised EPS?


Exchange Rate

  • mikeexpat
  • 31/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
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  • Wed, 18/02/2009 - 15:23

Please request M. Simpson to confirm the exchange rate to be used for US Dollar and Euro deposits in case of liquidation of KSFIOM by court decision.
Thank you.


The origin of the £550 million ?

  • coldlightofday
  • 20/10/08 31/08/09
  • a depositor
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  • Tue, 17/02/2009 - 23:24

This question may may been posed before?

As an individual the only way I would have around 50% of my net worth in cash ready for investment one afternoon in October is the recent sale of my house or business, or perhaps a legacy, in other words the realisation of a major asset. What had occurred that the bank was in a position to transfer £550 million?...

I am aware that many people had just made substantial deposits...
That there was the beginning of a run on the bank...

Is the very presence of 50% of the bank's assets ready to transfer to the UK in any way unusual or questionable?

How had the £550 million been accumulated? Repayment of massive loan? Huge amount deposited?


Yes, this had been answered.

  • frog
  • 10/10/08 13/09/09
  • a depositor
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  • Tue, 17/02/2009 - 23:57

Yes, this had been answered. The upstreaming started in early 2008 and continued until the bank stopped. There was not one large deposit made in one go.

The 50% issue is another one which apparantly isn't unusual for banks to do this, but based on the advice regarding the parent, it would seem rather obvious that upstreaming it to another subsidiary only lessens the risk and not removes it.


Costs of Administration

  • podather
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
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  • Tue, 17/02/2009 - 20:30

As HMG has targeted E&Y with working exclusively on the transfer of depositors accounts to ING for the first 6 months of the administration process does the LP know if HMG will be paying all the costs of administration for this 6 month period?

I cant see how other creditors of KSF UK can be expected to contribute to the costs of administration when for this period no work on recovery of their funds has been undertaken.
Would this also mean that HMG would not receive an equal % payout of KSF UK assets as all other creditors as the costs for the first 6 months would be wholly covered by them and then all costs going forward after that point would be deducted from all creditors at an equal ratio ?


Well it is being paid for - 4

  • frog
  • 10/10/08 13/09/09
  • a depositor
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  • Tue, 17/02/2009 - 23:59

Well it is being paid for - 4 months at 0% interest regardless if the bank's cash isn't used.

I'll ask the question.


Still more time to put your

  • frog
  • 10/10/08 13/09/09
  • a depositor
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  • Tue, 17/02/2009 - 16:25

Still more time to put your questions for the LP here


sale of ksfiom as to uk bank

  • mr lynton
  • 27/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
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  • Thu, 19/02/2009 - 18:16

Has LP had any approaches to buy KSFIOM from a uk bank?
It would seem to me to be a good punt for a uk bank to buy KSFIOM as:
1. Everyone would be happy to leave funds there with backing of a uk bank knowing they would be rescued by HMG- no depositor withdrawals.
2.Prospective buyer gets 140 million liquid assets, 400 million loan book, various other assets like CD's on deposit with other banks/building societies and the prospect of a decent recovery amount from KSFUK.
3. Bondholders would leave policies in bank if it was backed by a uk bank.
Maybe even HMG could put forward RBS to buy it to solve the awkward diplomatic problem - doesn't RBS already own another bank on the Isle of Man?
Is LP actively seeking such a deal from a uk bank?


PwC knew at an early stage

  • thesunnysouth
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
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  • Thu, 19/02/2009 - 07:43

PwC knew at an early stage how much cash was available to KSF IoM. Can E&Y provide the same detail for KSF UK. If not then they must be totally useless. What percentage of that cash would we be likely to receive. That will at least give an early heads up as to the first amount to be recieved from KSF UK.


PREFERENCE

  • everhopeful
  • 11/10/08 n/a (free)
  • a depositor
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  • Tue, 17/02/2009 - 20:05

KSF IOM creditors are supposed to rank pari passu with other unsecured creditors including HMG in the administration/liquidation of KSF UK. Can you therefore ask Mike Simpson if in fact preference has been given to HMG by having E&Y focus exclusively on transferring deposits to ING at the expense of working out a solution KSF IOM depositors? i.e. our chance of a solution via a sale for example has been jeopardised by delaying matters has it not?

As I understand the situation, potential buyers of KSF IOM have been put off by the uncertainty over the amount recoverable from KSF UK?

The net result of this is that we have the bizarre situation of British citizens i.e us repaying other British citizens regardless of how you say it.