KSFUK FIRST DIVIDEND OF 20% (VERSUS 10% ESTIMATED)

  • yorkist
  • 01/07/09 31/05/09
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Posted: Wed, 15/07/2009 - 02:20

KSFUK DIVIDEND OF 20%

This was announced on the KSFUK website on July 10, 2009 and also reported by the Times that same day. Also reported by the Times was that an E & Y spokeswoman indicated that a second dividend would be paid later in the year.

Does KSFIOM qualify?

In order to have qualified KSFIOM would have needed to submit a claim by June 18, 2009. Mike Simpson of PWC indicated in the June 1 conference call he would inform us about the claim when he submitted it.

No information forthcoming, has Simpson submitted the KSFIOM claim or not? A simple question and yet we do not know the answer. Perhaps the answer is in that promised Directors Statement of Affairs which was supposed to be circulated to creditors before the July 7, 2009 meeting, but which document, now at least a week late, has yet to see the light of day.

To have not submitted a claim, after all the time that PWC have had to agree the numbers and all the expense that PWC have heaped upon the KSMIOM depositors, borders on the incompetent. Perhaps too much time spent helping out the IOM Treasury with the SOA and not enough time being true accountants and agreeing the numbers.

Surely it is the responsibility of PWC to maximize the returns (both in magnitude and timing) to KSFIOM creditors and not to have turned in a claim to KSFUK is a dereliction of this responsibility.

Notwithstanding the fact that the KSFIOM claim would need UK Treasury approval to be paid, the claim should nonetheless have been put in on time, and if UK Treasury approval was granted (as in this case it was) KSFIOM would be in line for that July dividend.

Even if the dividend from KSFUK wouldn’t be received in time for the first dividend from KSFIOM, it would still be in the bank, earning interest and thus defraying some of those PWC costs. As it now stands, it looks like this money will stay in the UK, earning interest for the benefit of most of the other creditors of KSFUK.

The performance of PWC and Simpson has been nothing short of appalling. They spent our money on the doomed SOA without agreeing these fees would be reimbursed by the IOM Treasury beforehand, and why not, it meant more fees for them, more money in their pocket and it extended the whole process and would therefore put more money in their pockets in the future. The only numbers Simpson appears to be on top of are the PWC partner charge out rates and the PWC fees generated to date; and to think we are adding another £650+ partner to the team! We don’t need more of the same we just need fewer and better.

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From an inside source I have

  • jeffwilkins
  • 21/10/08 14/11/09
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  • Fri, 17/07/2009 - 15:08

From an inside source I have heard that practically all the money "lost" by KSFUK has been recovered and in fact there is now serious doubt as to wether the twins Brown and Darling needed to take any action at all last Ocotber.

SO?? WHY ONLY A 60% PAYOUT ??

WHAT IS HAPPENING TO THE OTHER 40%

Jeff Wilkins


I had heard something similar

  • steveservaes
  • 13/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Fri, 17/07/2009 - 15:18

I had heard something similar - and that if we don't get all our money back its because of all the costs generated by the administration.
Perhaps once the Icesave deal is done and dusted they might finally feel able to help us - though I won't hold my breath with that pair


Interesting news

  • Julienne
  • 16/10/08 31/08/09
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  • Fri, 17/07/2009 - 19:21

Can the source of this be substianted?
It would make interesting press if true and the terrible twins need not have opened their mouths!!

A calculation done ages ago - perhaps by Ice- showed that a 65% return from UK would give us 100% return -- Simpson should be pushing to find that extra 5%. Perhaps he and E&Y could take a pay cut to achieve it.


Claim has been lodged and approved with KSFUK

  • chd
  • 13/10/08 30/09/09
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  • Wed, 15/07/2009 - 05:49

According to Hopper's "New Numbers" Forum, the claim against KSFUK has been lodged and has had approval from the UK Treasury. Hopper got this info from the CC meeting last week, so it seems that Simpson did his job on that one. Not sure if this 10% has now gone up to 20%. At least the claim is in, and has been approved.

Excerpt from the New Numbers Forum http://chat.ksfiomdepositors.org/forum-topic/new-numbers-today

KSFUK
- UK dividend of 10p expected this month
- Minimum of 50p in due course
- KSFIOM claim has been lodged
- Clearance to pay to KSFIOM has been given by UK Treasury to E&Y
- The claim includes £349m of deposits, the share repo is still being discussed (agreeing date of termination), 41 derivative contracts with KSFUK (mainly FX and interest rate hedging), £164m of statutory set offs under loan participations


Thanks for correcting me on the update, but.....

  • yorkist
  • 01/07/09 31/05/09
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  • Wed, 15/07/2009 - 14:31

Swiss

Thanks for correcting me on the update.

I’m very concerned that the £ amount owed by KSFUK to KSFIOM numbers just keep on changing.

First we started with close to £560 million.
Then the £154 million repo agreement was deducted and we were at $406 million.
Then the £164.3 million sub participation loans were offset and we were at £241.7 million

Now the figure before sub participation offset is $349 million?
Bringing our claim down to £184.7?
Or $184.7 million less all the derivatives contracts etc.?

So is our first dividend going to be 10% (hopefully 20%) of £184.7 million? Or will it be less?

And about those sub-participation loans, do these just go away or are these loans which KSFIOM can still collect on? I don’t recall any discussion on this.

I’m sure if that Directors Statement of Affairs had been sent out, as Simpson stated it would be, then some of these issues may have been clarified or at least allowed for informed questions at the July 7 meeting.


@Swiss - claim approved?

  • anrigaut
  • 19/10/08 30/10/09
  • a depositor
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  • Wed, 15/07/2009 - 08:19

Swiss -
As I see it, the facts you resume above, as reported by Gavin from the Creditors' meeting (not yet a CC meeting!) - that (i) the claim from KSFIOM has been submitted to KSFUK and (ii) UK Treasury have given clearance for payments to be made to KSFIOM - do not necessarily mean (as you seem to suggest) that "the claim has been approved" and that therefore KSFIOM will receive 20% in the first round at end July.

I've no knowledge of these things, but I would assume that approval by KSFUK means approval not only of the right to claim but of the amount of the claim (needed to calculate the 20%) and this appears not yet to be resolved as it is still under discussion. We shall know soon anyway!


Confused still?

  • Ohdear
  • 13/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Wed, 15/07/2009 - 06:44

Can someone please explain (in simple language!) what does all these mean. How much of (percentage) of our money are we to get back. A few days ago 70-78% was banded around, where are we now. I am totally confused. This is nightmare!


Ohdear, re money back

  • Anonymous
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  • Wed, 15/07/2009 - 12:07

The 14.5% and 20% numbers that are being tossed about refer to the estimated amount of the first payout only, which is expected sometime in late August or September of this year. The 70% to 85% numbers are what is currently being suggested a likely total return. Estimates of the total return will obviously change as more facts come to light over the next 5 years. Even the amount of the first payout will not be known for certain until it is in fact declared.


oh dear.. work on 70 percent

  • hippychickrobbed
  • 03/11/08 31/05/09
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  • Wed, 15/07/2009 - 07:48

work on 70 percent, the rest will be a fight legally, parental guarantee, controlling liquidators expenses, or for 100 percent a political soloution..