EPS 2 Scheme being discussed now in Tynwald

  • expatfrance1
  • 15/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
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Posted: Tue, 17/02/2009 - 18:20

EPS 2 Scheme being discussed now in Tynwald


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Manx radio

  • Sophie
  • 16/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
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  • Thu, 19/02/2009 - 15:09

Kaupthing arguments continue at courthouse
Published online at 19/02/2009 13:20:22

The courthouse and general registry in Douglas.

Discussion over whether the collapsed Kaupthing Bank should go into liquidation are continuing at Douglas courthouse this lunchtime.

Lawyers are arguing the case for a winding up order to be granted, but there are also calls for a further adjournment to allow the Treasury's Scheme of Arrangement to be implemented.

The benefits of both proposals have been outlined to a packed courtroom number one.

Deputy Deemster Andrew Corlett is continuing to hear legal submissions.

Depositors demand public inquiry
Published online at 10/02/2009 23:45:33

The chorus of KSF depositors demanding a public inquiry into the banks' collapse appears to be reaching a crescendo.

And there's been a continuous outpouring of anger over the chief minister's performance before a United Kingdom Treasury Select Committee last week.

Manx Radio has been inundated with comments from depositors losing patience with the government's response to the affair.

The WI could have done better - KSF depositor.On Mandate at One today, Marian Kenny looked at some of them (text, below, from attached audio file):

The Kaupthing depositors are a determinted and highly motivated group, as you would expect, and have closely followed events since their money disappeared last Autumn.

Many have contacted us to say they feel the chief minister threw away an invaluable opportunity to defend the Island's financial system, and instead focus the Treasury committee's attention on the crucial role of the British government and UK regulators.

One, who signs himself a "devastated depositor", says the Isle of Man government had the chance to put some blame on the UK government but failed the depositors miserably. "The WI could have done better", he concludes. "Why did you let us down, and why did you bother going?" another asks.

The emails, many of them sent directly to Mr Brown, make disturbing reading for him.

"He chose to protect his political career rather than the KSF depositors" reads one, "you seem to be a lackey of the British government" says another. "Isle of Man government leaders are behaving like deer caught in the headlights", is another comment on those lines.

There is also widespread support for the call by Manx advocate Jonathan Smalley that the time has come for a public inquiry.

Many correspondents describe the distressing circumstances they now endure, including a retired woman who has returned from Spain to work in a care home.

Perhaps most worryingly the depositors are as one in asking: "If an apparently solvent bank which guaranteed the security of savings collapsed as it did, can the Island's reputation as a banking centre ever recover?"

It's a question for which, as yet, the answer is far from clear.

Winding up Order Adjourned

  • Ally
  • 13/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
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  • Thu, 19/02/2009 - 15:28

Adjournment until 9th April to allow SoA to progress


  • adrienne
  • 10/10/08 13/05/10
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  • Thu, 19/02/2009 - 15:44

Hi Ally. thanks for quick update. what is the adjournment expected to achieve in reference to the SOA? more detail on it? or to enhance it?

replying to my own question

  • adrienne
  • 10/10/08 13/05/10
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  • Thu, 19/02/2009 - 15:46

just fielding text from the court house. they say its for enhancement.


  • Ally
  • 13/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
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  • Thu, 19/02/2009 - 15:55


I missed the summing up. But from the rest of the session I would say that it is for both. One to allow the SoA to be finalised (i.e. for all the details to be filled in) but also I believe there could be enhancements. The big insurance companies supported in principle but were obviously not happy with the terms as they stand. For the first time they actually submitted affidavits. I think there maybe be some movement on the date of fx conversion as they came up a number of times.

The scheme manager would be the liquidators provisional.


  • skintagainnow
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Thu, 19/02/2009 - 15:41

Any conditions Ally??


  • Ally
  • 13/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
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  • Thu, 19/02/2009 - 15:48


I attended all the hearing before lunch but was unable to attend the after lunch session, but spoken to people as they have come out of Court so adjournment is confirmed.

Unfortunately I therefore missed the summing up. I will get more information as the afternoon goes on and post it up, if someone hasn't beaten me to it. All I know at the moment is that there will be the formation of a creditors committee.

It was touch and go, none of the advocates can put a convincing argument together. Insurance companies supported but were not happy and want improvements to SoA but in principle support it.

Very coincidental that theyve

  • roman05
  • 24/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
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  • Wed, 18/02/2009 - 20:39

Very coincidental that theyve approved this EPS 2 scheme the day before another D-Day!

The most wonderful place for your money? The Isle of Man!

  • Premier
  • 10/02/09 31/05/09
  • not a depositor
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  • Wed, 18/02/2009 - 13:42

At long last a safe place for “depositors” to deposit their money!
Where? The Isle of Man of course!

See the claptrap published today in the Daily Telegraph by Mr.M.Goodman. He obviously knows a whole lot more on this subject than all the members of the KSFIOM Action Group put together

Visit: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/expat/4681344/Isle-of-Man-well-placed-to-ride...

Write or telephone the Telegraph and thank them for supporting Messrs Bell/Brown/Aspden. Now!

Isle of Man well-placed to ride financial storm.
The Isle of Man's low-tax regime and business culture make it an attractive option By Mike Goodman . Daily Telegraph - 17 Feb 2009

Safe haven: amid stormy financial times the Isle of Man retains its AAA rating from global credit rating agencies and has low taxes. Many British expatriates must be wondering whether there are any safe havens left for their savings and investments.

Familiar high street banking names have needed government bail-outs. Bank shares have collapsed in value, former blue chip companies struggle. Interest rates paid to savers have fallen while the value of sterling has plummeted against major currencies.

The Isle of Man has not escaped the global financial turmoil.
Last October the once fast growing Kaupthing Singer and Friedlander (Isle of Man) bank (KSIOM) fell victim to the Icelandic bank crisis. The Manx authorities reacted by raising the maximum payable under the island's bank deposit compensation scheme to £50,000 for each individual. Savers with KSIOM are eligible for the payout but will have to wait until the outcome of moves to rescue the bank.
The Manx Treasury has offered interim "hardship" payments in the meantime. A key reason for the failure of KSIOM was that support from the parent Icelandic bank was not forthcoming when the Icelandic financial system virtually collapsed.

The Isle of Man government, by contrast, enjoys a strong financial rating as it ran comfortable budget surpluses during the boom years, and built up reserves against bad times. Significantly, the AAA rating on its government debt was recently reaffirmed by rating agencies Standard and Poor's and Moody's.
In particular Moody's noted that the £150 million earmarked by the Manx Treasury for bank compensation schemes "is clearly manageable against free reserves and projected capital spending."

Allan Bell, the Manx Treasury minister, said: "I welcome the fact that Moody's and Standard and Poors have reviewed our ratings and concluded the Isle of Man is well-placed to ride out recent storms and to withstand any future economic downturn."
However, Manx economic growth which reached 7.7 per cent in 2007 is almost certain to slow sharply this year.

The island's low tax regime is a key reason for its past success.
There is no corporation tax for most businesses, a top rate of income tax of 18 per cent, with a £100,000 "cap", no tax on capital gains or inheritance taxes, and indirect taxes such as value added tax account for most of the local tax "take".
However, the present Manx system could be under threat and not just because of the recession. In his pre-Budget report last October Alistair Darling, the Chancellor, announced an "Independent Review" of the UK's offshore financial centres, including the Channel Islands, the Isle of Man, Gibraltar and Bermuda.

The review, headed by the former financier Michael Foot, will not try to undermine present constitutional arrangements and the right of these centres to set their own taxation, according to the UK Treasury. But it will investigate how the financial industries of these UK offshore centres can weather the current financial turmoil.
One of the remits is to consider "financial stability and competitiveness".
Mr Foot is to submit an interim report in time for the next British Budget but no date has been set for a final report.

Should the report conclude that UK offshore centres need stronger government backing for investor protection and for keeping financial firms solvent, the cost might fall on local taxpayers.
The need to raise more money to support financial services might threaten the low-tax regimes of some offshore centre. For the time being, the Isle of Man can afford to keep low direct taxation and remains one of the safer offshore havens for savers.

The island's offshore life assurance business remains resilient. Indeed the prospect of higher tax and national insurance rates on the better off in the UK may even encourage new business. Customers of insurance companies registered on the island are protected by a compensation scheme in case the insurance company fails.
More bla bla bla …….

Telegraph Email address anyone

  • Alastair
  • 10/10/08 30/09/09
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  • Thu, 19/02/2009 - 15:59

Irrespective of DAG policy on not bombarding the media this one deserves a response. Does anyone have email address for the business/money editor?

Will forum site quieten down ?

  • BustedFlat
  • 20/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Wed, 18/02/2009 - 11:27

I guess the DAG forum site will get quieter once the £10k is out there. Can't remember what % of depositors will be out of the picture with £10k but it must be quite a lot.


  • Anonymous
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  • Wed, 18/02/2009 - 11:45

I doubt it.

There's not many <£50k who post here, let alone <£10k.

Increase the not-so-EPS £10k to £50k and it'll become a bit quieter, perhaps..........

Early Payment Scheme 2 Approved

  • expatfrance1
  • 15/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Tue, 17/02/2009 - 18:55

Early Payment Scheme 2 (Payment of up to £10,000) has just been approved by Tynwald. Only 1 vote against.

eps 10k

  • Anonymous
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  • Wed, 18/02/2009 - 04:37

So the EPS is substituting for the DCS. Sneaky, but I think the IoM have wound me in on this. After 18 weeks of nowt, I'm feeling I better grab whatever's going. Wonder how many of us this offer will reel in?

The EPS is NOT substituting

  • expatfrance1
  • 15/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
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  • Wed, 18/02/2009 - 06:49

The EPS is NOT substituting for the DCS/SoA or anything else. This constant mis information does not help anyone

hi expat

  • giveus backourfunds
  • 13/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
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  • Tue, 17/02/2009 - 18:57

are you clear what up to £10,000.00 meant ?

My understanding is that if

  • expatfrance1
  • 15/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
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  • Tue, 17/02/2009 - 20:07

My understanding is that if you have already applied for the £1,000 of EPS 1 then EPS 2 will offer another £9,000 or the balance of your deposit whichever is the smaller.

If you have not applied for EPS 1 then EPS 2 will offer £10,000 or the balance of your deposit whichever is the smaller.

These amounts are per depositor so a joint account will count as 2 depositors.

I didnt catch all of the Tynwald discussion but other posts on this forum have indicated that EPS2 does not unfortunately include Bond Holders.

Another interesting point is that despite Tony Browns poor performance at the TCS, Allan Bell again stated that the blame for all of this lies with the UK Government.


  • colinalvin63
  • 28/10/08 n/a (free)
  • a depositor
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  • Wed, 18/02/2009 - 02:03

I have to agree with Alan Bell - the blame for all this lies firmly with the UK Government.

blame brings nowt

  • Anonymous
  • Offline
  • Wed, 18/02/2009 - 04:31

The blame may lie with HMG, but so what? What's done's done. Blaming gets us nowhere. Even if the Browns claim to be the destroyers, so what?

I want the IoM to return our money. I no longer care who started it, because in the current moral climate there is never going to be justice. I just want our money back. From where, from who, for what reason - I'm easy on all of these. I want the IoM to give us our money. I'll give them a free hand in how they go about this.

Isle of Man Freedom to flourish

Whoever would've thought it? Fancy putting that on their emails, eh?

blame brings nowt

  • Anonymous
  • Offline
  • Wed, 18/02/2009 - 14:37

They mean "freedom to flounder" or "freedom to perish"

Freedom to flourish

  • Hampnew
  • 22/01/09 31/05/09
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  • Wed, 18/02/2009 - 12:29

Mr Bell stated in his budget speach that the was no recession in the Isle of Man, latest Deposit Base figures would appear to support this:


might be all we see for a while

  • Anonymous
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  • Wed, 18/02/2009 - 09:51

I'm going to have to take it, represents 80% of what I left with those idiots.

I'm a bit surpised at the

  • bozza
  • 12/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Wed, 18/02/2009 - 20:03

I'm a bit surpised at the lack of coverage this news is receiving, given that there's a good portion of depositors in the under £10k group (60 on this site?). Luckily I'm in this only for €7k

Has the £10,000 limit now been set, or is this subject to IoM govt approval?

Does anyone know what the trasury will do in respect of the exchange rate? At start of October or date of payment? As we are in neither DCS nor AoS this is not clear...

For your entertainment I offer the following gem from the bank on 30 September.

"Hi xxxx.

In the unlikely event of Kaupthing Singer & Friedlander going under then the Isle of Man Depositors Compensation Scheme would cover 75% of deposits up to a maximum of £15,000. Any remaining deposit would be covered in full by our parent Bank, Kaupthing Bank hf in Iceland.

If you invested £10,000 then £7,500 would come from the Isle of Man Depositors Compensation Scheme. The remaining £2,500 would come from Kaupthing Bank hf in Iceland.

Best regards.


Needless to say I was one of the "in flight" bunch as I tried to get off the sinking ship at lunchtime of 6th October. Ah well!

Any clarification would be appreciated