e-petition for http://petitions.number10.gov.uk

  • Emabroad
  • 10/10/08 30/08/09
  • a depositor
  • Offline
Posted: Fri, 17/10/2008 - 17:04

Why haven't we posted our petition on the No. 10 Downing Street site - http://petitions.number10.gov.uk/ - for maximum exposure?

The good thing about the No. 10 site is that everyone can sign - not only those affected. We need to amend the wording to allow all fair-minded members of the public, not just those directly affected, to vote. It is open to all British citizens and Expats too, and would allow our friends, neighbours and relatives to vote too. It could produce a huge response if we individually get our acts together and email everyone we know with the link, when it's up.

Other petitions with which I've been involved had great success with two previous petitions so let's go for it folks, after all - if you'll forgive the pun - what have we got to lose?? Let's sock it to them!!

[ng: edited title to make clearer which petition this is about]

0
Your rating: None

Comment viewing options
Select your preferred way to display the comments and click "Save settings" to activate your changes.

E Petition - should we try again?

  • hardyboyz
  • 13/10/08 01/03/10
  • a depositor
  • Offline
  • Sat, 01/11/2008 - 12:42

I have followed up the excellent range of suggestions for drawing attention to our plight by contacting MPs, IMf, TSC, Icelandic gov, etc.
I am now wondering if it is worth having another try to file an E petition.
I know that we have had two attempts rejected as "outside the powers and remit of the PM and govt". However as the focus of our strategy is now on MPs and the government I think we should consider this again.
I have prepared the draft below which has tried to focus on the areas I believe are clearly the UK government's responsibility and I hope this will stop it being rejected.
All suggestions, comments, ideas for improvement welcome. (I apologise to the non UK citizens for the focus on the UK in the wording but I feel it is the best way to get this accepted)

We the undersigned petition the Prime Minister to...
do all he can to help the thousands of depositors of Kaupthing, Singer and Friedlander (KSF) (Isle of Man). The vast majority of these depositors are UK citizens whose life savings are now in jeopardy following the government’s actions in freezing KSF(IOM) assets held in the UK.

More details about your petition (1000 characters maximum):
Kaupthing, Singer and Friedlander (Isle of Man) previously the Derbyshire Building Society (Isle of Man) was placed under a Provisional Liquidation Order by the Isle of Man courts on October 9th as a direct result of the UK government’s decision to freeze the assets of KSF(IOM) held in the UK.
If this money is not returned, and KSF (IOM) is allowed to go into liquidation, depositors stand to lose hundreds of millions (£). Many of these depositors are UK citizens living in the UK, Isle of Man or temporarily working abroad. Some have their whole life savings at stake and are absolutely heartbroken.
We request that the government provide protection for these innocent depositors by all possible means including:
Release of all KSF (IOM) assets currently held in the UK.
Assisting in any way it can to facilitate the purchase of KSF (IOM) as a going concern.
Representing the IOM (as is its constitutional responsibility) in all negotiations with Iceland and the IMF and continue to require that the Icelandic government, as current owners of Kaupthing hf, honour the parental guarantee of these deposits.
We ask for help from the UK Government to resolve this situation as soon as possible and relieve the suffering of thousands of its citizens.
Please help. Sign our petition.


Petition Rejected

  • Peasant
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
  • Offline
  • Mon, 03/11/2008 - 10:43

The rejected petitons

We the undersigned petition the Prime Minister to Include U.K.depositors in Kaupthing Singer Freidlander in the Isle of Man in the 100% guarantee to all other Icelandic Bank depositors in the UK

and
We the undersigned petition the Prime Minister to Save countless British and Crown Dependency citizens from financial ruin by ensuring the return of all savings held by all customers of Kaupthing, Landsbanki and their subsidiaries, thereby restoring confidence in the Isle of Man, Jersey and Guernesey as financial services centres and protecting the islands’ economies.

have both been rejected on the grounds "* It was outside the remit or powers of the Prime Minister and Government"
I fail to understand exactly what in either of the petitions comes under that heading.
Maybe we should ask our MP.


Petiotion rejected

  • Monkeyface3604
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
  • Offline
  • Mon, 03/11/2008 - 11:04

I th9ink we need to be blunt and say that we want the money held in Kaupthing UK on advise of the FSA to the FSC to be returned withgout delay or penalty. THat is something that is in the goverments remit!!!


what does fall within the remit

  • mrken30
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
  • Offline
  • Sat, 01/11/2008 - 15:38

Maybe we should ask a more general question, eg Will the British Government , provide support and aid for British citizens who are located overseas.

maybe Scottish devolution would be a good thing and then atleast we would have a foreigner in power and they would change the rules to allow non UK residents to have bank accounts


epition - anything with IoM on it gets rejected - trying this

  • skintagainnow
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
  • Offline
  • Tue, 21/10/2008 - 21:03

I've noted that anything with IoM in the Actual petion gets rejected :- therefore trying a different tact - the only place IoM mention is in the More Details section : the Actual Petition reads as below. If we can't get through one way lets go after Darling & Brown & force the issue into the open.

We the undersigned petition the Prime Minister to provide details and a certified copy of the communique received by Rt Hon Alistair Darling MP Chancellor of the Exchequer (or other UK government official) on or before 8th October 2008, whereby the said Rt Hon Alistair Darling MP Chancellor of the Exchequer stated in a public forum on the 8th October 2008 that the Icelandic Government had informed the UK authorities that it has no intention of honouring its obligations in the UK.

Submitted by ******** Deadline to sign up by: 21 December 2008

Category: Government, politics and public administration

More details:

On 8th October the Rt. Hon Alistair Darling MP Chancellor of the Exchequer stated in a public forum that he had a received a communique from an Icelandic official, stating that the Iceland government had informed the UK authorities that it had no intention of honouring it's obligations in the UK. Subsequent actions by the UK government in freezing the assets of one bank namely Kaupthing Frielander & Singer (UK ltd) resulted in another bank outside the UK's jurisdiction namely KSF (IoM) ltd going into administration. The result of this administration is that thousands of British citizens have no access to their savings and may ultimately lose those savings.


rejected e-petitions

  • mrken30
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
  • Offline
  • Sat, 01/11/2008 - 15:18

I submitted a petition that just asked the UK government to provide financial vehicles such as bank accounts for UK citizens that are living overseas and this also got rejected.

I feel that HMG just wants to encourage immigration and help all those that live in the UK and forget about the brain drain that is leaving the UK. I feel so ashamed of being associated with such a government and at the moment want to severe all ties. However I still have family there and my heritage lies there.


e-petition rejected

  • skintagainnow
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
  • Offline
  • Sat, 01/11/2008 - 12:45

Yep - this one was rejected too


mikeinfrance, thanks for your

  • Ben
  • 13/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
  • Offline
  • Mon, 20/10/2008 - 18:35

mikeinfrance,

thanks for your input. i was not necessarily positioning myself as a representive of members of this site or anyone else when i applied for the e-petition. i was just trying to get something done. the 'wooly' wording (thanks!) was intended to throw the e-petition open to as wide an audience as possible (which isn't easy when you are restricted to less than 1000 characters).


e-petition

  • mikeinfrance
  • 12/10/08 28/09/09
  • a depositor
  • Offline
  • Mon, 20/10/2008 - 18:54

OK I assume then that you're not a depositor..I believe that there was another e-petition specifically requesting the return of £600M from KSF UK to KSFIOM liquidator provisional,but lost track of progress on that.


e-petition application REJECTED!?!!?

  • Ben
  • 13/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
  • Offline
  • Mon, 20/10/2008 - 18:11

received the following reply from the application to start an e-petition that I submitted about a week ago. very bad news, if you ask me, as it suggests that the UK government thinks that ensuring depositors receive their savings are returned is 'outside the remit or powers of the prime minister and government':

"Hi,

I'm sorry to inform you that your petition has been rejected.

Your petition was classed as being in the following categories:

    * Outside the remit or powers of the Prime Minister and
Government

If you wish to edit and resubmit your petition, please follow
the following link:
http://petitions.pm.gov.uk/saveoursavings/ChcSUlCHt3jfAS4bVvAOHcE

You have four weeks in which to do this, after which your
petition will appear in the list of rejected petitions.

Your petition reads:

We the undersigned petition the Prime Minister to: 'Save
countless British and Crown Dependency citizens from financial
ruin by ensuring the return of all savings held by all
customers of Kaupthing, Landsbanki and their subsidiaries,
thereby restoring confidence in the Isle of Man, Jersey and
Guernesey as financial services centres and protecting the
islands’ economies'

Large numbers of British and Crown Dependency Citizens are
facing financial ruin as a consequence of the UK Government’s
invocation of anti-terrorism laws to seize the assets of
Landsbanki and Kaupthing banks. The action was intended to
protect British citizens from the fall-out of a financial
crisis in Iceland. But thousands of British and Crown
Dependency depositors (domestic and overseas residents) are set
to lose their life savings as a direct consequence of the
Government’s action. Failure to guarantee the safety of
customers’ savings will have a disastrous impact on the
economies of Jersey, Guernsey, and the Isle of Man, leading to
capital flight and job losses. We therefore petition the
Government to ensure that all depositors of Landsbanki,
Kaupthing Singer & Friedlander, and their subsidiaries in
Britain and its Crown Dependencies, have their savings returned
in full to prevent devastating personal losses and to restore
confidence in the islands’ financial institutions.

-- the ePetitions team

Search News"


e-petition

  • mikeinfrance
  • 12/10/08 28/09/09
  • a depositor
  • Offline
  • Mon, 20/10/2008 - 18:25

This is the first time I've seen this e-petition.Is this supposed to represent the KSFIOM depositors ie those on this site, or a wider group of people? The wording seems somewhat wooly and it's not clear to me what is being requested.


Re Petition wording

  • worriedsaver
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
  • Offline
  • Sat, 18/10/2008 - 20:40

Am I mistaken in believing that the UK government also gave a 100% savings guarantee to savers in Northern Rock Guernsey ? Does this not set some kind of precedent ? Can we include this in No. 10 wording ?


e-petitiion - waiting for authorisation

  • Ben
  • 13/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
  • Offline
  • Sat, 18/10/2008 - 19:33

just to let you know, i posted an request for an e-petition a few days ago but it still hasn't been authorised.


ePetition for all to agree

  • Andy Ish
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
  • Offline
  • Sat, 18/10/2008 - 20:08

First of all thanks to Hardboyz for taking the initiative to cut down the main petition in to an epetition format as we have restriction on number of words,
Just so you all know a few points to keep in mind

I have not rushed with an ePetition because a someone has and its not yet authotised on 10 DS site as yet. It will take up to 5 working days to know if it has been accepted and we can all sign it or if its rejected. I STRONGLY SUGGEST WE DO NOT INITIATE ANYMORE BECAUSE THIS WILL CAUSE DUPLICATION AND COULD MEAN THEY ALL EPETITIONS GET REJECTED.
(sorry I do not mean to shout. with the amount of posts I for one try and speed read so just wanted to highlight it).

Another issue worth mentioning, only British Citizens can actually sing it or residents of the UK i.e if you have a home address. Unfortunately non UK Citizens and people without an address in the UK can not theoretically sign the petition.
I strongly suggest we all lobby all our contacts that we know asking them for their support. I for one have 350 people in my contacts who I will lobby. If we all do this in addition to the depositors we should make up the shortfall in numbers due to the ePetition rules which is unfortunate. I am assuming that not 100% of The Action Group here are British or have a UK address. I apologise for that, I do not make up the rules. I will leave this for 24 hours then I will post it on 10 DS site and will send the link for everyone to go in and sign the petition. The name I will put it under is Kaupthing-SF so if you use this in the search then you should be able to pull it. But remember it can take up to a week from posting to be visible for you to sign it electronically.


We the undersigned petition the Prime Minister to...

do all he can to help the thousands of stricken depositors of Kaupthing, Singer and Friedlander (Isle of Man) and to guarantee 100%, the deposits of these people as has already been done for mainland UK depositors with Icelandic banks.

More details about your petition (1000 characters maximum):

Kaupthing, Singer and Friedlander (Isle of Man) previously the Derbyshire Building Society (Isle of Man) was placed under a Provisional Liquidation Order by the Isle of Man courts on October 9th.

If KSF (IOM) is allowed to go into liquidation, depositors stand to lose hundreds of millions (£). Many of these depositors are UK citizens living in the UK, Isle of Man or temporarily working abroad. Some have their whole life savings at stake and are absolutely heartbroken.

We request that the government provide protection for these innocent depositors by all possible means including:

Assisting in the purchase of KSF (IOM) as an ongoing business,

Guaranteeing all deposits to 100% as is the case for other Icelandic banks in the UK.

Requesting that the Icelandic government honour the parental guarantee given at the time of purchase

We ask for help from the UK Government to resolve this situation as soon as possible and relieve the suffering of thousands.

Please help. Sign our petition.


Possible ambiguity in epetition wording?

  • ianhkhi
  • 12/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
  • Offline
  • Sat, 25/10/2008 - 22:23

"...as is the case for other Icelandic banks in the U.K...." could be taken to mean that the petitioners believe that KSF(IoM) is an Icelandic bank in the U.K.

Maybe leave out 'other'?


E-Petition: Correction: Overseas Brits and Expats CAN Sign!!

  • Emabroad
  • 10/10/08 30/08/09
  • a depositor
  • Offline
  • Sat, 25/10/2008 - 22:12

Having been involved in several e-Petitions to Downing Street - which is why I mentioned the idea - I can assure Andy Ish that there is a drop-down menu where one will find check-boxes for overseas members of the armed forces AND for Expats. You simply have to load your overseas address.


petition

  • GABS
  • 11/10/08 26/06/09
  • a depositor
  • Offline
  • Sat, 18/10/2008 - 19:22

Great idea to have a petition on the no10 website. I too have been involved in these successfully in the past.

Thinking that a search of the No10 website using 'kaupthing' must return our petition. Im not sure if KaupthingSF does this. Worth checking.

GABS


Proposed text

  • Andy Ish
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
  • Offline
  • Sat, 18/10/2008 - 18:41

Kaupthing-IOM seems to be taken. This is my proposed text pretty much the same as original just cut down.

If all are happy I will load this under the name of KaupthingSF


We the undersigned petition the Prime Minister to...

Support the depositors of Kaupthing IOM who stand to loose their whole life savings livelihood and are in crisis financially due to the freezing of Kaupthing UK which caused the collapse of Kaupthing Isle of Man

Therefore we appeal for the following:
1. That the Prime Minister confirms in a statement that UK Government is seeking the return of 100% of all deposits held within KSF IoM (even in the event that KSF IoM is wound up) and considers that to be the only satisfactory outcome.
2. That the UK government requests the administrators of KSF UK release all assets belonging to KSF IoM in order that it may seek to resume its normal operations.
3. That the Isle of Man Government, without undue delay, reinstates KSF IoM’s banking license to enable it to resume its normal operations.
4. That the UK Government, in conjunction with the IoM Government, implements the same 100% guarantee for all depositors’ money in KSF IoM as has been afforded to other KSF depositors.
5. That the Icelandic Government, as primary stakeholder and controller of Kaupthing Hf, acknowledges its duty to honour the parental guarantee given by Kaupthing Hf to all KSF IoM depositors.
6. That the Icelandic Government ensures that any entity taking control of Kaupthing Hf or any new entity arising out of the assets of Kaupthing Hf is required to honour


PETITION SIGN UP BUTTON

  • malc
  • 11/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
  • Offline
  • Sat, 18/10/2008 - 14:24

NG, can a sign up button be added to the site. Asked about this many times now but as yet can't see a response.

Everyone needs a quick method of adding their name to the petition. We can use the same button to sign up to the e-petition, therefore killing two birds with one press ....

malc


http://petitions.number10.gov.uk/

  • Atol
  • 12/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
  • Offline
  • Fri, 17/10/2008 - 22:04

I agree Emabroad. Everyone here can sign this electronically. Whether or not it will be accepted on the site who knows!

Look here: http://petitions.number10.gov.uk/

Suggested text:

We the undersigned petition the Prime Minister to...

do all he can to help the thousands of stricken depositors of Kaupthing, Singer and Friedlander (Isle of Man) and to guarantee 100%, the deposits of these people, many of whom are UK based tax payers and UK nationals/expats working abroad, who have been innocently caught up in the UK/Icelandic banking crisis.

More details about your petition (1000 characters maximum):

In 2007 The Derbyshire (Isle of Man (IOM)) was sold to Kaupthing, Singer and Friedlander (KSF) (IOM). Depositors were given a full parental guarantee by Kaupthing bank (Iceland).

On 9 Oct 2008, following events in the UK, when KSF (UK) fell into administration, the Isle of Man courts made a Provisional Liquidation Order in relation to KSF (IOM) Ltd.

Depositors with KSF (IOM) now stand to lose hundreds of millions (£). Many here are just ordinary hard working people from the Isle of Man, UK based tax payers, ex-patriots working/living abroad, pensioners and other foreign nationals. Some have their whole life savings at stake and are absolutely heartbroken.

With only a £50k guarantee in the IOM, depositors find themselves floating in limbo between the full guarantees offered by the UK to UK depositors in Icelandic banks, and the full guarantees offered to Icelanders by their own country.

We ask for help from the UK Government to resolve this obvious unfairness.

Please help. Sign our petition.

(1000 Chars)


I posted a very basic

  • mrken30
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
  • Offline
  • Sat, 18/10/2008 - 15:10

I posted a very basic petition monday or tuesday and am still waiting for it to be approved, I will post the link as soon as it is approved. However I think a more detailed petition would be good if we can get it


Petition to no 10

  • bellyup
  • 10/10/08 09/01/10
  • a depositor
  • Offline
  • Sat, 18/10/2008 - 10:58

Im interested and will definitely sign
Is someone putting it on the petion site?


All Can we agree a text and post an epetition?

  • Andy Ish
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
  • Offline
  • Sat, 18/10/2008 - 10:19

All I agree and I have suggested this idea initially. For some reason no one seems to be interested apart from turning up. I think both routes should be followed. Can we work together on the text from Diver and put it forward on an epetition. Then post a link directly so people can sign the petition. There is 1100+ users on this site and they may be able to help us.


Email petition thread

  • IceCrusher
  • 14/10/08 25/10/11
  • a depositor
  • Offline
  • Sat, 18/10/2008 - 14:28

An email petition was being pursued here:
http://www.ksfiomdepositors.netgenius.co.uk/?q=node/140&page=2
Scroll down half a page..
It got put on hold with the effort to produce the paper version


PETITION

  • malc
  • 11/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
  • Offline
  • Sat, 18/10/2008 - 15:50

IceCrusher,

Can we concentrate first on getting everyone to sign up to the paper petition first. Once thats done we can all put our effort into the epetition
at the moment, the two threads are causing confusion as to which petition people are signing up for.....

malc


e-petition

  • ng
  • 11/10/08 31/12/20
  • a depositor
  • Offline
  • Sat, 18/10/2008 - 12:11

I agree, definitely a good idea. One thing to note: "We aim to make your petition live on the website within five working days, although during busy periods it may take longer. " - from http://petitions.number10.gov.uk/faq

So the sooner the better. 1000 chars max, as has already been pointed out.

Volunteers for a project manager for this?


Epetition

  • hardyboyz
  • 13/10/08 01/03/10
  • a depositor
  • Offline
  • Sat, 18/10/2008 - 10:34

Andy,
I would be happy to help draft and post an Epetition. Where is the text from Diver? I can use that and the suggestion from Atol. Then we can get something up today.


Epetition

  • Andy Ish
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
  • Offline
  • Sat, 18/10/2008 - 12:17

Hardboyz yes please. Let make it as close as possible to Divers. If we can keep it identical would be better. I will post it on 10 downing Street and iniate it.

ng - Can I open a link for epetition in a seperate tab at the top so people can go and sign it directly. We need to email all registered users with the link message so that we get maximum effect and quickly. It will also save everybody asking the question "Where do I sign the epetition". I see there has been a lot of interest already.


Epetition

  • hardyboyz
  • 13/10/08 01/03/10
  • a depositor
  • Offline
  • Sat, 18/10/2008 - 14:00

Andy,
I have had a look on the number 10 website. What we have to put is a short statement that starts with:
"We the undersigned petition the Prime Minister to...."

There is then a section where you can post details of your petition. This allows 1000 words max.
I have checked what I believe to be the final version of the petition and it would be OK to fit in here.

However our the current petition starts with the phrase "We the undersigned, depositors in Kaupthing Singer & Friedlander (IOM) Ltd..."
Do we want to restrict signatures to just depositors or should we use this as a vehicle to try and gain support from others?
One possibility would be to post the following:

We the undersigned petition the Prime Minister to...

do all he can to help the thousands of stricken depositors of Kaupthing, Singer and Friedlander (Isle of Man) and to guarantee 100%, the deposits of these people as has already been done for mainland UK depositors with Icelandic banks.

Then under more details we can either post the full petition,or a simpler summary such as:

Kaupthing, Singer and Friedlander (Isle of Man) previously the Derbyshire Building Society (Isle of Man) was placed under a Provisional Liquidation Order by the Isle of Man courts on October 9th.
If KSF (IOM) is allowed to go into liquidation, depositors stand to lose hundreds of millions (£). Many of these depositors are UK citizens living in the UK, Isle of Man or temporarily working abroad. Some have their whole life savings at stake and are absolutely heartbroken.
We request that the government provide protection for these innocent depositors by all possible means including:
Assisting in the purchase of KSF (IOM) as an ongoing business,
Guaranteeing all deposits to 100% as is the case for other Icelandic banks in the UK.
Requesting that the Icelandic government honour the parental guarantee given at the time of purchase
We ask for help from the UK Government to resolve this situation as soon as possible and relieve the suffering of thousands.
Please help. Sign our petition.

This may allow non depositors to also support us and sign.
Let me know your thoughts.


ePetition

  • Andy Ish
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
  • Offline
  • Sat, 18/10/2008 - 15:42

Hardboyz I agree, you are right. send me your final text and if no one has any objection, I will go ahead and post it on line. This will take 5 or more working days before its posted if accepted by 10 Downing St, then people could go online and sign it.


Agreed. get it done...

  • Atol
  • 12/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
  • Offline
  • Sat, 18/10/2008 - 15:26

Agreed. I'm sure everyone here will sign up to this.


PETITION

  • malc
  • 11/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
  • Offline
  • Sat, 18/10/2008 - 15:31

Guys, please just for the moment, can we ask for your help in getting the written petition out first, its being delivered on Monday in UK & IOM.

We need everyone to sign up AND be there. Two threads are causing confusion.

Once we've got that sorted, I promise I will put all my efforts into helping you get the epetition up.
malc


Epetition

  • Pat
  • 10/10/08 30/11/12
  • unspecified
  • Offline
  • Sat, 18/10/2008 - 14:22

Agree - let's go ahead - I have friends and family in UK who are willing to join a petition but who are not depositors.......


e-Petition

  • AJM UAE
  • 11/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
  • Offline
  • Sat, 18/10/2008 - 14:04

I agree that we should open the petition to as many people as possible. There are people out there (friends, relatives, depositors who were lucky enough to have closed their accounts in time) who would gladly sign the petition. This has the advantage of adding UK voters to our list of signatories.


Petition

  • amar
  • 13/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
  • Offline
  • Fri, 17/10/2008 - 17:23

Apologies but I have been in meetings all day. Please can soemone confirm if anything is being presented in London on Monday as I want to be there. Meet place, time etc.....Thanks


Amar London 20th Oct Monday Parliament square

  • 1log
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
  • Offline
  • Sat, 18/10/2008 - 18:41

Contact Diver and Lucky Jim and give your details