A COMMENT

  • Diver
  • 11/10/08 31/05/09
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Posted: Thu, 15/01/2009 - 00:14

We realise that there is a lot of despondency and understandable frustration following the meeting with Alix Partners and IoM Treasury - these feelings are very much shared by all involved.

Please don't take silence on the part of those at the sharp end of this to mean that we are sitting idly by or allowing the IoM to run rings around us...that is simply not the case. We are exploring more avenues than you could possibly imagine to achieve a successful resolution to this mess. NO ONE is out of our sights at the moment and we are actively investigating numerous avenues (including right now at this time of night!).

Before you are tempted to believe that we are being 'suckered in' by anyone just remember how much time and effort has gone into all of this. Some of us know more about the situation we are dealing with than those we are up against and the team has dedicated too much time and effort to this to give in to an inappropriate solution that does not achieve our objectives in any shape or form. We will continue to do everything possible to get 100% of ALL our deposits back.

Further comments from us, responding to postings, appear to just add fuel to the fire of those who enjoy a good rant and that isn’t what the majority of our group wish to see. To those of you who have supported us unequivocally through all this from the very beginning and trust our integrity and judgement we'd like to say a very big thank you it's really appreciated by all of us.

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Thank Goodness You Are Still Fighting !

  • colinalvin63
  • 28/10/08 n/a (free)
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 19:14

It's great to hear that the core team are still fighting hard to get a positive outcome.

It's just as important for ordinary DAG members to keep lobbying though. It's too easy to sit back, get depressed and do nothing.

We simply can't let the UK Government or IOM Government off the hook.

Keep hitting them hard and never give in.

Thanks for your efforts & comforting words Diver.


Dear Diver

  • mikepapa
  • 10/10/08 n/a (free)
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 19:05

Dear Diver and Committee,

Thanks for your update, you have my full confidence in your
continued negotiations and pressure on our behalf, for an
equitable resolution.

Kind regards,

Mike


Diver

  • moneypenny
  • 27/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 14:05

Again, thanks from me and Hubby for all the efforts of you, Diver and the core team. It is much appreciated.

We must get a piece of good news soon mustn;t we??!!

Please keep up the good work.


Turn up the heat?

  • saversinfrance
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 14:49

I would like to add my thanks to Diver and the Team in whom I have complete confidence.

However, I wonder if the time might have come to take a harder line with IOMG. I think that they have taken advantage of our desperation, goodwill and patience but reserves of these three resources are now in very short supply.

I simply don’t buy the IOMG’s statement about not being bothered which route is taken (DCS or SoA) otherwise why have they twice postponed the winding-up order? Nobody believes that it was to protect the depositors’ interests.

So, how about we say something along the lines of “If you don’t come up with a workable scheme with timescales and payment details that offers significant benefits to ALL depositors (over DCS) in time for review before the 29th January, then the DAG will favour winding-up”.

I know that there are serious concerns about the DCS but at least it has some substance. Whether it’s liquidation or not the crucial issue is still the money held in KSFUK and if this, or a substantial proportion of it, is released everyone will get their money back. My real fear is that we agree to some half-baked rescue plan whose main purpose is to buy time and save the reputation of the IOM at our expense – and the longer the whole thing is dragged out, the less will be left in the pot. At least a winding-up will force the start of some sort of payment schedule and we can then concentrate our efforts on getting the money in the UK released.

Let’s call their bluff.


Diver

  • moneypenny
  • 27/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 14:04

Again, thanks from me and Hubby for all the efforts of you, Diver and the core team. It is much appreciated.

We must get a piece of good news soon mustn;t we??!!

Please keep up the good work.


Diver re Alix Partners and IOM treasury

  • fight theft
  • 10/10/08 28/05/13
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 14:02

Firstly a huge than you diver for your unrelenting grand efforts. You are the voice of reason and sanity. You must be so tired writing this at 2.14 am after yet another big day. May you be blessed with continuing strength and health to cope with this fighting with the right people on your side.
I must say I have been very uneasy about the lack of news from the IOM treasury, Government, Alix & partners, Our legaltaems and Mike Simpson etc after Christmas. Well all the way along since October actually.

Where do we find any progressive news? Have they agreed to disclosure of the sealed documents for instance? Are all possible bank sales cancelled due to the 557 million not be accessable? Shouldn't we have issued a writ to E&Y London for immediate return of our monies proven by audit?

I do hope both London and IOM legal teams are still doing their best - we haven't heard anything form IOM legal since mid December - anything further to report form them? I know you are doing your utmost and cannot take on any more can some other core team members and legal teams tell us more.

I am back in London (temporarily for this mess then once sorted I will be leaving this country of my birth for good - all Labour governments have sent me working abroad and this is the ultimately the worst). If I and any other London residents can do anything for you please let me/us know.


Unequvicable Support

  • Stunned Mullet
  • 17/10/08 n/a (free)
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 13:59

Diver and all those working at the sharp end for us, you have my total support and appreciation. I'm sure I'm joined by the majority of folks out there in the ether. To the armchair critics, see if you can do any better, I personally don't believe so for one minute.


Thank you, Diver

  • Lostinspace
  • 13/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 13:19

Diver,

You are voice of sanity and reason in all this mess that has been dragging on for ages now. Thank you, sincerely, for all your hard work. Great stuff.


Appreciation Diver + Team

  • steelwood
  • 24/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 10:53

All solutions on offer from IOM are just to delay as long as possible , and shows the intention to screw the despirate depositor but we still have put full trust and confidence in DIVER + TEAM to come out for a batter solution and get us all out from this unthinkable mesh.

Where has gone the incredible raiting AAA of Isle of Man to safeguard the depositors in very regulated banks???


News re today's affidavits?

  • Hoping and coping
  • 16/10/08 31/07/10
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 10:40

Thank you for the reassurance, Diver - it's much appreciated.

To echo pipho's question: When are we likely to get to know the details of the affidavits due to be filed today? (I haven't given up on the IOMG or the Liquidator Provisionally yet...)


Thanks

  • Anonymous
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 10:22

We can only add our thanks and support. We really do appreciate the incredible efforts of you and the team, and of many others on this site, and also recognise the stress that the 'ranters' must add unneccesarily. Please keep up the good work, it is certainly a lifeline for us.


Support for core team

  • grandmaparis
  • 13/10/08 30/09/09
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 10:12

Diver,
I can't thank you and the core team enough for all your efforts. As I've said before, I've implicit faith in your ability and determination to see this through to a satisfactory conclusion. We will not give up.


Thanks

  • caledonia
  • 14/10/08 30/09/09
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 09:44

I have been logging on daily since the beginning and re-iterate Romasanta's comments. A HUGE THANK YOU as I just cannot imagine where we would be without you !!


Thanks Diver

  • shafted
  • 10/10/08 12/12/09
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 09:39

Thanks Diver for your recent comment, i am sure you and all the team must be more frustrated than most in view of all your hard work. I suspect that the David Green of the legal team has his hands full this week with his case on the N Rock juditial review of which i have an interest also, and hoping for a favorable result.I am sure you and others will find a way forward, it is a pitty the tresury questions sequal was not sooner.
There has to be a political solution to this, i commented weeks ago that the IOM was having a day of prayer for the finantial crisis, i am beginning to think they are expecting the good Lord to help!. Come on IOM GOV get real you only have a short window to get into gear with HMG.


An oasis in the desert

  • romasanta
  • 16/10/08 02/10/10
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 08:45

Diver & the team: My thanks again. Its a great comfort to read your comment. I wish I could do more.
I feel very fortunate to have you on my side. You represent an oasis of strength and common sense in a desert of darkness.


Diver and team

  • anrigaut
  • 19/10/08 30/10/09
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 08:20

Well said - and once more heartfelt thanks for your untiring efforts on our behalf. I never for a moment imagined you were sitting idly by or not reacting to this latest totally inadequate response from IOM. But it's still good for morale to hear you saying so!

It seems to me that a political solution is the only way out of this dreadful hole. Surely there must be a way for HMG to make a humane gesture to us, along with the other unsecured creditors of KSF-UK, without losing face? Or are they really as uncaring as they appear? As a former (old) labour voter, I still find that hard to stomach.

Keep up the good work. Bon courage à tous.


Backing!

  • qatar
  • 15/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 08:19

Diver,

When i get the time to log on here, i head straight for your latest comments / update.

You and your team have my 100% backing. Sorry i cant be of more help..

As and when this is ove we will all owe you a big debt of gratitude i am sure!


Diver's comment

  • chb
  • 10/10/08 15/10/09
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 06:19

Thank you to Diver and the core team. You have the unreserved support of my partner and I.


With you 100%

  • Sophie
  • 16/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 07:41

Its my birthday today which is also the day we are returning to the UK. So busy busy. But our thoughts are with you Diver and the core team. We are with you 100%


Well said.

  • SgKZ
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 05:32

I think the team are working incredibly hard for all concerned regardless of some of the dissenting comment.

Do the IOMG realise just how close they are to a run on all of the banks on the island? Is that the the thing they fear the most? Sorting out the funding for the DCS, rescue package/loan/re-capitalisation will look so much more attractive than having every single one of us putting other expats in the picture about the so called 'protection' and governance offered by the IOM.

I am in a profession that has several thousand expats working overseas and it wouldn't take alot of effort to inform them of the struggle that we are having. Those that have accounts there would probably move there accounts pretty sharpish and those that don't will simply never bank there....ever. The IOM is literally a key-stroke away from becoming Iceland.

They really have to pull their finger out NOW and not just offer the bare minimum. If they don't have anything concrete to offer today and they start fudging the DCS issues, I and I am sure many others, will be shouting 'Shark' as loudly as possible for anyone swimming in their waters...

No pun intended 'Diver'! Keep up the good work!


I AM WORRIED ABOUT THE ISLE OF MAN BANKING SYSTEM

  • merlin
  • 14/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 06:14

If I don't get 100% of my hard earned savings back I will think it my duty to warn people about the banking systems of Isle of Man. Anyone who has worked with big corporate companies knows that the easiest way to see someone fall are the words --- I'm worried about Tom - Dick - Harry !


re I AM WORRIED ABOUT THE ISLE OF MAN BANKING SYSTEM

  • colinalvin63
  • 28/10/08 n/a (free)
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 19:09

If we don't get a satisfactory outcome to all this from the IOMG, we quite reasonably should warn other people that the IOM is NOT a safe haven. We could do this by writing to editors of recognized investment journals or publications that would normally be used to promote offshore investments. We could honestly mention our experiences and warn people away from investing in ANY offshore jurisdiction. With EUSD tax set to rise to 20% this year, there will be little or no incentive to invest offshore, especially given the risks we have encountered.

I think it would be only fair to warn the IOMG of our intentions beforehand, just to clarify their thinking a little and make them a little more focussed on getting 100% of our savings back.

Let's face it if any other offshore jurisdiction cannot be regarded as a safe haven, then it must surely meet it's maker. They can't be permitted to keep taking people's money. I think that Guernsey will never be taken seriously again after the pittiful payout to those stung by the Landbanki collapse.


Direct action Group?

  • nivit
  • 19/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 08:45

Direct action Group?


Wigan Athletic To Be Sold to Iceland? Say It Ain't So Joe!

  • VikingRaider
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 08:30

I'm more worried that Kaupthing HF will demand Wigan Athletic as part of its out-of-court settlement with HMG. (see News postings) As for Douglas, it's difficult to say at this stage exactly how IOMG is performing -- given all the cloak and dagger doublespeak, I'm witholding judgement. I'm just glad I don't have US dollars in a US bank account -- just watch for the mega-devaluation later in the year.


merlin..

  • hippychickrobbed
  • 03/11/08 31/05/09
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 06:30

merlin no one baby will bank there again,all the expats, they will just see what happened to us., It would be regarded as safe as zimbawe.....run as fast as you can.


Divers comment

  • cottesmore
  • 21/10/08 16/07/12
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 04:58

Thankyou for posting this comment.
My thoughts regarding the outcome of your meeting, with IOM and Alix Partners,were of utter disapointment.I could not even post any sort of comment.What restrain,considering the usual crap from, he who shall remain nameless.( i leave it to you, to guess)
But, at NO time, did i ever believe, that after all that has been done by the core group,(and all of us) that you would just sit there and let us all get, shafted, by a bunch of people, who are not going through what we all are.
I, for one,will not change my total and complete faith, in the core team.I believe you continue to be in control of the situation.I remind all, that at present,we are not in a position to know the tactics of the core team.This was outlined to us all, in Divers previous updates.I am very aware, also,that people 'cling' to every scrap of info.It was very apparant that people felt very dispondent.I personally, have struggled to 'sit' on the outside of all this.It has always been in my nature to,get stuck in and get results.I ran my own company employing over a 100 staff.I was 'in control.' But for now,others are holding the reigns.We must continue with that support and most definetly stay united.Please remember,'it's not over,till the fat lady sings!'
Keep smiling.
Mark


Good man cottesmore, to put

  • expat
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 05:10

Good man cottesmore, to put it bluntly this is about negotiating, not about faith in the IOM gov or anyone else except ourselves. Moves to up the ante are being made. There are other parties in all of this, some with possibly more power and cohesiveness than us, I suspect that situation was reflected in the presentation give. We know the baks don't really want the DCS sprung, I am sure the big 5-6-7 don't want litigation. Think it through.

Again this is not about faith its about negotiating, always always was. Its about pressure.


Hear Hear

  • mikepapa
  • 10/10/08 n/a (free)
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 19:31

G'Evening Expat,

All agreed....

It would help to see IoM Gov talking to HMG and getting them
to put some pressure on E&Y to come up with some indication
of any ' ball park' return from KSF UK - which IMO is the key to
any restructure or run down of KSF IoM.

Trust all well, your end of the world?

Kind regards,

Mike


Evening Mike, cold and snowy

  • expat
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 19:48

Evening Mike, cold and snowy here, so we'll get a bit of skiing on Saturday morning!! Hey its free!!

Good to see you are still with it MIke, hard day maybe, but I think its just one of those days. We just need to make sure all parties know OUR TERMS now. Seems we need to start fighting on more fronts really, quite a lot to handle for a small group in my view. Hard to keep up some days!!! And distance doesn't help.

Anyway been helping the mother in law today, moving stuff for her.

I'll be in touch!!

Steve


It is clear to us all, that

  • calpespain
  • 12/10/08 n/a (free)
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 04:30

It is clear to us all, that those of you dealing with this, at the sharp end are by far, more capable and indeed much more articulate and with a sharpness of mind that cannot be matched within the IOM governmental ranks. Or indeed anyone that they have employed to act in this matter.This is why, we find ourselves still in a hole and not on the ladder climbing out. Hopefully, you will together, make them see sense soon and actually come up with a workable solution that will benefit us all. But to wait 12 months for no pay outs at all, is unacceptable, unjust and inhumane of a government to allow.They should be made to see the human cost to all of this and be held accountable after all, we didn't invest our money in Zimbabwe although it feels like it.

We are grateful and thankful for your compassion' shown by comments made' and for your determination to get a justified and, as much of our money back as possible.


Thanks Diver, a reassuring comment

  • sami
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 03:33

I've never stopped believing in you - thanks for this reassuring comment. I know we shall eventually look back on this situation and you will be remembered for your hard work and successful efforts, as will the other members too.

You have our support until the end - I only wish I could return and assist you.


Thank you Diver et al

  • brokefirefly
  • 12/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 00:23

Thank you! Please continue to let us know what we can do to support you.


Things are moving

  • dclf1947
  • 10/10/08 31/08/09
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 04:01

Diver, thank you and the team for all the effort you are putting in. I believe that the UK side of the issue are slowly coming to a head with some MPs seemingly beginning to take more interest in us. Your proposed meeting in early February with the Treasury(?) shows this and questions must be being asked. Unfortunately political issues take a long time but I think the actions by Mr. Darling etc are being recognized. This maybe the reason the IOM still appears to be sitting on the fence!!


Diver and team - thanks is not enough

  • Daughter
  • 17/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Thu, 15/01/2009 - 03:53

Diver and team - thank you does not say enough for all the time, energy and patience you have shown. As Brokefirefly say how can we support you?