Actions taken or being taken

  • Anonymous
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Posted: Fri, 10/10/2008 - 04:35

If you are contacting someone, be it media or other, and you feel it might benefit others on the site, please give the details.

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please no

  • Thor Halland
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 15:55

the last thing we need is for a run on the IOM banks and the whole thing to fall apart then we are guaranteed NOT to get any money back.

Anyway I'm a real person - My name is Thor Halland and I live in Thailand

My Number is +66 38 734080 if anyone wants to get in contact especially 'Expat'


I'll ring you, how many hours

  • expat
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 20:20

I'll ring you, how many hours ahead are you? About 8 I'd guess!


Make Some Noise

  • MichaelN
  • 11/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 14:23

I respect everyones view , and plan but my thoughts would be to try and get a run on the IOM Banks create instability and get Gordon Brown to step in and give effectively a parental guarantee to all deposits held there .

The inability of Tony Brown to stand up and say that all KSF deposits are backed by the change to the 50k limit should concern everyone , this is the simplest piece of the equation .

Make noise , tell your story and go round to your MP in UK and wait until he sees you and then tell him the pain .

I have written to my Battersea MP Martin Linton emphasising that this is a British Issue , for British Citizens who like me have paid Tax on these earnings , only 40 k with me BUT it hurts and its financial theft of the highest order

I dont like people I dont know telling me to be quiet , its unnerving and not realistic

Sorry but ....we must emphasise our story , a run on IOM would not be allowed to happen , look at The Big Banks base there .


I Agree ( 950K GPP at stake )

  • worriedsaver
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 15:33

I am afraid that I also have agree with MichaelN . I also think maximum noise will draw attention to this issue . A possible run on IOM deposits would force the UK government to step in . I have already made some withdraw instructions . That said I do hope behind the scenes negotiations will work and should satisfactory guarantees be offered I would be prepared to leave my funds in the IOM for a given period of time at possibly even a reduced interest rate and possibly even return funds to the IOM . I do not however feel comfortable doing nothing to publicise our plight while many other groups are receiving large amounts of attention at present in the media .


MichaelN and elsa, nobody is

  • expat
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 15:20

MichaelN and elsa, nobody is telling you to do anything, some us are asking that actions are considered carefully if you want your many back. Gordon Brown is a great bloke at the moment, but he has NO legal jurisdiction on the IoM, but has a legal duty to represent IoM on the international satge. What ever action you wish to take entiretyl up to you, I suspect the monent when any actions any of us wish to take is past anyway.
I can only say that I and others have attemted to get the IoM to grasp that run is a very real possibilty and that can have far reaching consequences. There are big banks here yes, so were Lehman Bros, AIG, Goldman Sachs etc etc. I have no doubt that the threat of a run is hanging like Damacles sword over Tony Brown, but he is not Gordon Brown, nor does it seem that the back-up exists. I hope I am wrong on that. I assume a run is happening anway at the moment, so it is up to you what you say and do.

PLease try to see that it might seem that KSF (Iom) is a solvent ban and that its assests are frozen in the UK as I understand it. It is unlocking those assets and repatriating them to IoM that helps us.

As I say I have $720,000+ involved in this, pretty much all I have and family that desperately wants to come home, so what chances I have of ding that I'd like to secure. Please do whatever it is that makes you feel better, I am doing exactly that here. Please consider what you do for all our sakes, maybe you are coorect and the time is quickley arrivng when voices need to be raised. But at resent I have faith that somethinmg can happen around the negotiation table that will save my families dreams. There is a lot of pain in me right now, but I am trying to remain rational and conduct myself rationaly. Hey I may be wasteing my time, but thats the way it is.


Expat I left a message at the

  • 208
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 15:36

Expat I left a message at the reception of the Sefton with my phone number on it and e-mail address. Give me call or mail me.


For Gods sake get real.

  • 208
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 15:17

For Gods sake get real. Gordon Brown will do what's best for his own treasury. He will not bail out the IOM, Iceland or any other country with UK tax payer money. I know it's hard to do and I have had the same thoughts myself but stay calm, at least for the time being. A run on the IOM banks is the last thing we need. Unless you want to lose your money all of ours and other peoples money in other banks at the same time. Is it not now obvious from what has happen somewhere near the Arctic circle we are all connected financially. One goes we all may go down. Ever played dominoes ?


Precisely. UK local

  • occams razor
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 15:48

Precisely. UK local government is owed £1 billion from the Icelandic banks. How do you think GB would explain to UK taxpayers and voters that they will face higher taxes in order to bailout people who mostly live abroad, banked with a foreign bank, which wasn't even in the UK, and who most of the British public view (wrongly) as tax-dodgers? Even if there was a remote chance he might guarantee UK banks in IoM, what makes you think foreign banks like Kaupthing wouldn't be excluded?
I'm not telling you what to do, but please be realistic on your calls for "our voices to be heard" publicly. You may feel we are deserving, you may be completely right, both of those are pretty irrelevant... the British public will not see us that way. They will also see that there is a compensation scheme "so you are OK", without understanding the inadequacies of it.
What is for sure in my mind is that any run on the IoM banks would screw us completely, all it would do is compound the problems facing those who may be trying to help us such as the other banks there.


Maybe wait a while?

  • ng
  • 11/10/08 31/12/20
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 15:01

I think writing to your MP is a good idea, that's not going to cause a public panic. But any deliberate scaremongering might be very dangerous, for us, for the IoM and others. You may be right, but would there be any harm in waiting a while - a week or two perhaps - by that time something may emerge. I don't see that much would be lost by such a short delay, what do you think?

Surely the best solution for everyone would be a similar one to what's happened in the UK - another bank to step in. Presumably that will only be feasible if the money (our money!) is actually in the UK rather than in Iceland, and that in turn is probably highly debatable and a question of how the accounting is done. We know that the IoM subsidiary was wholly owned by the Icelandic parent, but others have indicated that their actual investment was done through the UK operation. That would seem to make sense, since in most cases (presumably) accounts were in sterling. So if our money is in the UK, it seems to me that there's hope. Am I being naive?

Imagine the potential chain reaction - a run on IoM based banks in general. Would it stop there? Maybe Jersey and Guernsey would be next, then Gibraltar, then England itself?


I could agree more. If there

  • Elpasout
  • 10/10/08 31/08/09
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 14:40

I could not agree more. If there is a deal to be done it will be done. The IOM weak response to the events and the consequent instability in the IOM market will already be factored into any deal.

Our problem is BEING HEARD not MAKING TOO MUCH TROUBLE!!

If there is a run on the the IOM next week it is going to happen anyway. Does anyone really imagine we will be resonsible for that? People are cr*pping themselves already. I supect investors will pull money out of even relatively strong IOM banks like Alliance and Leicester (Santander) and Nationwide IOM.

I seriously doubt our efforts will precipitate a collapse in the IOM financial system!! The IOM, Icelandic and Brit govs seem to have had a fairly good crack at doing that already!

There is no time to be lost IMHO


Dunno though

  • ng
  • 11/10/08 31/12/20
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 17:36

The net is a pretty powerful medium. In the old days you had to get into the newspapers, onto TV or radio etc - not any more. The world has never had this type of economic situation and the net. Just a chain email could have a big impact - "please forward this to everyone you know so that they don't lose their life's savings like we have" - that could get to millions of people within days. Add some youtube content, facebook, etc, etc. What has happened to us would seriously scare anyone who thought it might happen to them, even if the chance were small. To be avoided, I think.


MichaelN - Most respectfully

  • occams razor
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 14:45

MichaelN - Most respectfully that sounds like a totally disastrous strategy to me. What gives you any confidence at all that Gordon Brown would "step in and give effectively a parental guarantee to all deposits held there [IoM]"? Isle of Man is a completely different jurisdiction and the UK taxpayers purse is not, despite what some may think, bottomless. And if he didn't then we'd all be screwed, not even with hope for any IoM compensation. I think it is the absolutely last possible thing I want to happen.

I don't understand why people seem to think the £50k doesn't apply to us - It says right here that the new regs were passed on 9th October, and that so far KSF(IoM) is not technically in default:

"The Commission is presently advised that, if the DCS were to be triggered in respect of KSF (IOM), it would be subject to
the Regulations in force when the event of default was declared. At the time of
writing (10 October) an event of default has not yet been declared."

http://www.gov.im/lib/docs/fsc/PressReleases/kaupthingsingerqanda.pdf


Calm is needed

  • skintagainnow
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 15:40

A run on the IoM banks is NOT in our best interest, together we may have £30m that wouldn't cause a ripple anywhere. I'm in this for over £200K it's everything I have (except £1,600.00 in my UK nat west current account) after that I'm finished - no work - no home - nothing -- It looks like UK dole here I come - can't claim anything in France. I just have a little better than a pile of stones in field here - no caravan - no motorhme for winter.

I need that capital back, whether it's 1 or2 years I don't care but I have to have back, something to live on in the mean time is all I require a run on the banks now would finish that hope.

Even if the IoM economy could stand it £5K / annum for the next 10 years wouldn't do me any good.
I've been on the bones of my a**e before, the recession of the late 70's an engineering officer straight out the navy back to the
North East England - not a chance of work. Lost everything... house sold for negitive equity / so no money / no work / & still owe thousands - but young enough to pick up / dust off and get on with it, lie about rank, qualifications just to get work "downgrading" had to start as a labourer then fitter before I could start applying for positions my qualifications would allow (Ok so I'm not proud of some things) and work back though the system. I'm too old to do that again ---

Give the talks a chance

BTW we lost the last battle with Iceland :-) in the 70's


Seems to me most people

  • ng
  • 11/10/08 31/12/20
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 15:24

Seems to me most people understand that the 50k now applies - not the same 50k as in the UK, as it comes from a different source, just the same number and similar rules. The problems are:
(1) It could take a long time to receive the payout. During that time, at best we're losing interest and the money is devaluing with inflation, at worst we're unable to pay bills, in debt, homeless or suicidal.
(2) Many people had considerably more than 50k invested, and understandably won't rest until they get it all back (plus interest please!)


EXPAT and our strategy

  • occams razor
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 12:59

Everyone... I have just spent half an hour on the phone with EXPAT. I won't breach his confidence but I feel a need to say a few things about him and some of the arguments he's expressed here previously, as I know many have concerns, and in the situation, rightfully so. I am just a smallish saver ($12k) with nowhere near as much to lose as him or many others of you.

  1. I am convinced he is a KSF(IoM) depositor just like the rest of us whose sole concern is getting our money back. As to all the secrecy, I do not think there is anything untoward, just a desire to protect those people on the island who he has been fortunate to have discussions with, and many of whom also stand to lose like us.

  2. I believe he is in as desperate a situation as the rest of us, and is speaking/acting only in what he strongly feels are the best interests of all depositors to get our money back. I do not believe he is only looking out for his own interest at the expense of us, nor trying to effect something that would only benefit him.

  3. There appear to be huge amounts of high-level talks of a political, commercial, and international nature going in the background that neither you, nor I, nor he, is a party to. These talks are way above our heads, and his, and there is nothing at all we ourselves can do to influence them - but these talks succeeding are in our interest. He is not involved in them, but as he is on the island he has been able to get some information as to their broad nature. We are all the smallest of fish here, even those of you with £1 million or more at stake. There are large financial institutions with immeasurably more at stake than us, and whose interests would appear to be also best served by a successful outcome to this matter.

  4. Any such talks and deals are highly dependent on calm and quiet from both KSF and other bank's customers, and the markets, and the more publicity there is at this stage can only do harm to our interests. Maybe in the future there will be a time for making a noise, but now is really, really, not that time.

  5. I know we are all feeling frustrated and desperate and want to shout out to the world. I was one of the ones who advocated this over the last few days - you can see from my earlier posts at the other forums. But I am now convinced this is not the right strategy and I would strongly suggest you not to do that now, and to hold back any efforts to publicise this more, for the time being. Of course it's your choice. There is no certain timescale or decision date, everything is fluid, but I believe everyone in these talks is seeking a solution to all this, and FAST.

  6. He cannot be certain of a successful solution to all this, but he does have some hope this will work out one way or another, and the best chances of that happening are for these talks to run their course, as quietly as possibly.

There you have it. This is just my opinion, maybe history will prove me wrong (don't blame me if I am, I'm no expert), and you can judge it as you wish. I'm just a small-time British expat saver with less to lose than many others of you who are in more tragic circumstances. But I feel for all of you and hope this will all work out for everyone.

I'm going to get out of the house and try not to think about all this too much.
Wishing you a nice weekend, albeit in difficult circumstances.

PS - Please don't copy/paste this message to other forums. Thanks


I agree with you folks, i am

  • MAXMAN
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 13:39

I agree with you folks, i am no expert either and this is only my opinion, we should remain calm and hopeful that someone will save us from doom be it the UK government or a bank that may pottentially takeover. Yes and you are right there are very high level negotiations taking place at the moment, the IOM government have alot at stake so Im pretty confident that what comes out will be positive for all of us. Also I would be happy for my money to stay in the IOM if there was a takeover of somekind. We are not in the position to ask for alot are we? I am pretty hopeful that we will get all our money back.


Seems to make sense

  • ng
  • 11/10/08 31/12/20
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 13:38

... but there are quite a few other forums, not just this site.


I couldn't agree more. Calm

  • 208
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 13:22

I couldn't agree more.
Calm heads all round will help more than shouting into the wind.
Threatening to close all IOM accounts is not going to assist negotiations.
And to remind those of you who have lost track of the matter.
The UK Government seized the assets of a solvent IOM bank not the other way round.


In simple terms this is what is happening as I understand it

  • expat
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 13:59

Dave thank you that is the very core of the matter, frozen assets and discussions and negotiations in Iceland and the G7. That is how this works, the options are to refinance and allow KSF and Landbanski to trade or call on the guarantees. To do any of that needs flexible thinking and political will at the highest level. That is why PWC cannot transfer funds JS, which sorry, I thought was obvious. If funds could be transfered we wouldn't be here would we?
As it stands it seems a little light is showing in Iceland over Landbanski and I pray we are on the menu as well.
The Iceland position is that Kaupthing and Landbanski had assets to trade and the Treasury/FSA acted prematurey to freeze those assets under the Terrorism Acts. I hope that is correct, because if it is then there is a deal there. If not then the guranatees will be pulled and there is a deal there as well. But that takes Gordon and his boys to agree to be flexible, because the IMF will only proceed to rescue Iceland if Gordon stops pilaging the vikings!

Am I being clear enough here, I new this on Thursday, because it is frankly extremly obvious in my view. My actions have been to attemt to apply pressure in a anther part of the Matrix, one it seems Manx is very conversant with. Depositor protection and even the Irish, because I was aware of that as well I'm afraid Manx, I have been working in the international world a long time.

So in a nutshell that is what this is all about, my desire for 'secrecy' is one to protect those both here and abroad that have advised me, and two to save my own dignity for making such a fundamental error about a bank when I should have nown better! I can't have my daughter thinkinhg her dad is a f...g prat now can I????

The next position was that I also discovered the three banks expression of interest before I arrived at the Gaity Theatre the other evenimg. As I have had a little experience of rubbish like this I knew when not to rock the boat as they say.

In essence that is what this is about. the run on the banks is a very real thing because Manx has just told you all that nobody on the IOM is safe and to move what you have onshore! Do you truly think that only a few of us know that??? My info is that it aleady happening, which scares the pants off me. IoM will go under and any hope KSF (IoM) has of a rebirth goes with it if that escalates ovwer the weekend, are you all getting the point? At this momet you can, I think, assume that better people than me, with far more power than one man, are already taking action at the top levels here. I hope they have power to act, but Manx thinks not I sadly I suspect he is right because one of my new friends is of the same opinion. However, the linkage to London may overcome that, if political will and the entire UK economy is jepordised, which you think is a bit dramatic, but these are dramatic times. There will be a political price to pay to save the IoM if that is the case.

I hope I am wrong about some of it, I hope I am right in my belief that a deal needs to struck because such a lot rides on it aside from family and all of yours. We'll see won't we.

THere are legal issues invloved as well ere, but I am no lawyer, I have nowldge of contracts, but not enough, maybe Manx can explain the inter relationships involved, because from what I heard at The Gaity Theatre from Aston and Docherty wasn't very coherent a few too many contradictions for my tastes!

Ah it does appear that I am at least recovering my ability to type and spell, must be a sign!!!!!


The UK Government seized the

  • icdbrazil
  • 10/10/08 30/11/09
  • a depositor
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 13:28

The UK Government seized the assets of a solvent IOM bank not the other way round.

Well put.


One last thought before I get

  • occams razor
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 14:29

One last thought before I get out of the house to see sunlight...

The main reason I now have at least some hope is this. After the panic of the last few days when it seemed nothing was being done about us, I have come to this conclusion. This is all about banking confidence. The stock market has lost like 40% or something. The global banking system is at threat. As far as the powers that be are concerned the only issue they care about now is confidence, because it is fear that is sinking the markets - not really the fundamentals any more. Therefore it is in the direct interests of all Isle of Man banks, The Isle of Man Govt, the UK Treasury to some extent, Iceland and even the IMF to sort this mess out and try to keep confidence. In normal times some of them may have been more than happy to see us thrown to the dogs, but unfortunately for them in these times to allow us to sink on our own would also jeopardise their own interests, and so hopefully they will be forced to act otherwise. I really hope so.


c4

  • jenren
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 12:47

I should be on the Channel 4 news tonight to tell my mothers story. People seem to be listening to us.


What time are you on Channel 4? :)

  • carlosherbane
  • 11/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 12:55

What time are you on Channel 4? :)


hopefully tonight

  • jenren
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 13:12

on the news this evening all going well. I am worried that people dont want us to go to the press but i am passionate about my mothers situation and hate the fact that the media have no idea about us. I understand about charities being in the news and i am sypathetic. We are living on the hospitality of friends and i would like the support of people on this site as they have been a tower of strength for me.


Frozen Assets

  • podather
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 12:41

So if the assets of KSF IOM resided in either London or Iceland and the UK government has frozen the assets of KSF in London and Icelands assets in the UK why can they not offer us protection against our deposits.
It strikes me that the are underpinning the guarantee to KSF London depositors via ING with the assets transferred from KSF IOM and leaving us currently blowing in the wind.


PLAN: COMMIT TO LEAVE DEPOSIT IN IOM

  • JS
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 12:31

It was suggested that we commit to leave our deposits in the IOM for a fixed term to increase chances of a successful takeover of the bank. I put this forward to Mike Simpson, here is his reply, not very positive. (PS I haven't slept the last two nights):

Thank you for your email. The current problem with the suggestion is that, in order to transfer deposits, I need to be able to transfer the assets backing those deposits, which are largely at Kaupthing London or Iceland. If I had the assets backing the deposits, I wouldn't need to consider a transfer as I could just pay people out.

I realise this is a very distressing time for you and your fellow depositors. All I can do at this stage is promise you that I am doing everything I can to recover the assets which back the deposits.

Regards
Mike
Mike Simpson | Partner | PwC| Sixty Circular Road, Douglas, Isle of Man, IM1 1SA


What to do with other funds in IOM banks?

  • ManxFX
  • 11/10/08 31/05/09
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 12:28

I hear that Anglo Irish Bank IOM has taken on 13 temps this week to handle the rush of depositors wanting to avail of the Irish Govts unlimited protection.
THIS IS PREMATURE AS THE IRISH FINANCE MINISTER HAS YET TO CONFIRM THE IOM SUBSIDIARIES ARE INCLUDED IN THE SCHEME. Further the Icelandic gov gave similar guarantees and small jurisdictions cannot effectively underwrite their banks deposits ..Ireland is small too, in comparison to their banks deposits, and doesn't control the banknote presses of the EU unlike Gordon Brown does over Sterling!!
So right now INDIVIDUAL IOM depositors in Ango IB are covered by the new scheme and all other depositors eg family Trusts,company deposits, have zero cover just head office guarantees....same as ALL IOM banks.
So temporarily move your funds to UK banks if you can...until this mess is sorted...or be aware of the huge exposure here on the Island.
The manx Gov also cannot guarantee any compensation scheme directly..and to be fair have always said so hence they collect the compensation retrospectively from all bank license holders....and in getting them to agree upping the limit to £50,000 they had to limit the cover to INDIVIDUALS so the total liability to the remaining banks is probably REDUCED overall as all commercial deposits and trust holdings ( including personal lifesavings in pensioners trusts and charities funds) ARE EXCLUDED FROM THE NEW COMPENSATION SCHEME, just be aware of this, and be cautious where you place any remaining funds.


Irish Government guarantee IOM

  • madmax836
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 13:18

Hi

I had a meeting with my IFA on 10th friday to clarify if Ireland is guaranteeing 100% of monies in IOM.

This is the case with Irish Nationwide and Anglo Irish check out www.irish-nationwide.com

Hope this helps


This is not the forum for

  • occams razor
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 13:25

This is not the forum for discussing other IOM banks. There are plenty such as:

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/forumdisplay.html?f=17
http://www.moneysupermarket.com/community/forums/savings-6.aspx

Kindly keep discussion here directly relevant to matters concerning KSF(IoM) as we have enough posts to wade through here already.
Appreciate your help in this.

Thanks.


MP

  • benharvey
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 12:07

I have heard from my MP, she is writing to the Treasury on Monday.

She does not believe the UK government will allow people to loose out in this case.

Fingers crossed.

Ben


Reply from my MP

  • carlosherbane
  • 11/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 11:33

I wrote to my MP (Tyne Bridge). I have been trying to get onto this site for more than 24hrs! :( What else can I or should I do? HELP. Any ideas?

Carlos


I got a reply from an email

  • christ
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 11:16

I got a reply from an email that I sent to my local MP.

Dear ######,

Thank you for contacting us, Susan has asked me to send you a quick email to touch base on this - she is very concerned by your situation and while we have been dealing with many constituents who are concerned by the problems that are arising in this crisis- the fact that you have not been offered full compensation is a real worry.

Susan wanted me to let you know that she is in the process of getting a meeting for next week with a Minister to clarify your situation. Both the Parliamentary and constituency office are speaking to various Lib Dem's as well as the Government to try and establish some answers on this for you.

As soon as we know more Susan will be contacting you

Please feel free to call the office next week - the number is below

Best Wishes

Sarah Kipps
Office Manager for Susan Kramer MP for Richmond Park Suite 302 Parkway House Sheen Lane London
SW14 8LS


email & phone number Susan Kramer MP for Richmond on Thames

  • fight theft
  • 10/10/08 28/05/13
  • a depositor
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 17:51

I also live in this Richmond on Thames constituancy please could you give me the email address and phone number to conatct MP Susan Kramer. I am abroad at present and post would take too long. Thanks SuzanneB. Urgent action required.


susan kramer

  • anna98
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 20:49

her website is http://www.susankramer.org.uk/ - has contact details etc.
i'm also in richmond, so if you need anything, please do contact me.


Expat

  • Monkeyface3604
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
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  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 10:27

Hi Expat

I have been involved in theses forums pretty much since the news broke.
500,000 pounds, my parents entire life savings is caught up in the deal, we would be prepared to leave it in an IOM bank for a fixed time if it came down to it but as both of them are alost 70 i would prefer that they were able to enjoy it while they were still around.
You sound like someone who knows what they are talking about and therefore i am prepared to put my trust in you, please dont let us down (no added preasure there lol)
I am a serving U.K. police officer and part of my training is the use of media and media strategies. Therefore i know that it can be a double headed viper, calm for now but if we did need to proceed with the media a firm media strategy would be required. With all these charities in the lime light we could come across as a bunch of self centred money hungry richies when in actual fact we are desperate working class (all be it very hard working) familes who stand to loose our futures and dreams.


surely if they hear personal

  • jenren
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
  • Offline
  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 13:04

surely if they hear personal stories of people possibly loosing everying... not rich fat cats then people can have nothing but sympathy for us??? I am going to tell my mothers story and it is simply heartbreaking, i am hoping and praying that our money is returned but in the very real scenario that things are not that simple then people need to hear our voice before the news finds somthing else to focus on. We cant loose everything. I dont have media training but i dont want to sit back... any advice??????


Totally agree with the double

  • expat
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
  • Offline
  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 11:04

Totally agree with the double headed viper anology officer! Yes we can use it if we need to I agree with you. Added pressure!!All I see is my kids face and the phrase you are best dad in the world, anythinmgh else is mere decoration monketface!! I can take it and thank all of those that are utting the world on my shoulders!!! Thank you for the trust I have actually just had a phone call from a amn that knows a bit and he like me sees a little light at the end of the tunnel.

Take care a keep in touch, and yes people like us will look pretty bad by comparrison won't we, innocent of the charge as we are.


Lets hope we can return those

  • Monkeyface3604
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
  • Offline
  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 11:26

Lets hope we can return those wonderful warm smiles to the faces of all our loved ones


Well thats the idea I have

  • expat
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
  • Offline
  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 11:51

Well thats the idea I have monkeyface, its what is driving me along really.


Be careful with the "fixed

  • Captain Mainwaring
  • 11/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
  • Offline
  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 10:40

Be careful with the "fixed time" bit, unless based upon a percentage of deposit remaining with the bank. All in all though, I don't see any investing bank wanting to take on people who just want to run, they want continued business, which they could get if they could turn this around, that and the fact the several hundred ex KSF clients won't start posting all over and frightening the hell out of other IOM customers.

I see that as the reason why people may not want to make a problem in the IOM, that they have bonds with other banks that they cannot touch, and they don't want to lose those too (don't blame them for that).

My principals are high but available in limited quantites, thus, if things don't move a bit, then the tree needs so be shaken.


I agree, but its been 2 days,

  • Monkeyface3604
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
  • Offline
  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 10:58

I agree, but its been 2 days, lets give them a little time.
If need be later on we can unleash the fury!!!!


Seems like a lifetime....

  • Captain Mainwaring
  • 11/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
  • Offline
  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 11:02

I had really hoped that there may have been something more positive in the way of interest in a buyout by now, the longer it goes, the less chance there is.
And of course a weekend doesn't help either.


Your Member of Parliament

  • go mann
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
  • Offline
  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 10:23

Last night I remembered that I am a Registered Overseas Voter, and have thus just sent "my MP" an email. In that message I drew his attention to this site, and asked him to bring to the attention of appropriate colleagues [on both sides] the fact that some £30M has been lost in KE(IOM) by British ex-patriates. I expressed concern that the [largely unrepresented] ex-patriate community might get forgotten in the midst of the complex multi-Governmental negotiations.

It is hopefully useful that I am still a Vice-President of his Constituency Association, that I was an active member of his Constituency Team, and that my wife was on the panel that initially led to his selection as the Parliamentary Candidate! And ... he is a Shadow Secretary of State, and highly intelligent, and a jolly good chap!


Your member of parliament

  • bushmen
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
  • Offline
  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 12:29

Hi Go Mann,

Thanks for your post, that is encouraging.

Please also remember that it is not only expat's that are affected.

We all value our life savings and part of leaving your money in a bank, thus not spending it and not investing in risky investment vehicles shows that we are responsible citizens thinking about the future and believing in the banking system.

Unfortunately we've all learned a hard lesson here though. I believe in the grand scheme of things and present government bailouts, £84m is a drop in the ocean, and therefore hopefully we can come to some sort of an arrangement with either the governments in question or a business taking the company over if it realises.

I believe finding a solution to this issue is in all party interests since the Isle of Man government wants to promote IOM as an offshore banking destination and this would seriously harm that concept, and obviously us as depositors need to resolve the problem too.

Lets get the message out that we are all effected and stand together to make sure we all succeed in getting our futures secured.


my deposit through Clerical medical insurance company ltd

  • pimki36
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
  • Offline
  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 10:18

Can any one put me in the picture????i have a global account with CMI, a large part was with KSF,IOM.
Am i entitled to a compensation or does CMI ? Absolutely not sure where i stand


Pimki

  • barbados
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
  • Offline
  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 10:35

It's a bit of a grey area life companies pool their monies together so essentially all the monies are held under the name of Clerical Medical, so essentially only one account holder. However life companies will argue that there are a number of individual policyholders in their bonds and banks forcd them to open just one account as opposed to individual ones for each policyholder. I'm imagine they have or will be seeking legal advice on how to pursue compensation for all of their clients.


clerical medical

  • pimki36
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
  • Offline
  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 10:44

Thanks barbados,for the info.
I had rang their office on IOM, but the secretary was vague,managers were not present all day friday.,nobody there seems to know themselves what the situation is.
I have a many more bank deposits with them.This looks like i should take my money out of IOM ..a.s.a.p.
What do you think?


Pimki

  • barbados
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
  • Offline
  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 10:48

Have you an email don't necessarily want to post a reply to question on this site in light of what some of the guys have been saying below. I'm out for an hour or so but promise to get back to you.


i do but i don't want it

  • pimki36
  • 10/10/08 31/05/09
  • a depositor
  • Offline
  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 11:17

i do but i don't want this to show on this site..hmmm.


Observations

  • ManxFX
  • 11/10/08 31/05/09
  • unspecified
  • Offline
  • Sat, 11/10/2008 - 09:49

Some £850mill were on deposit here of which £150 mill held in local banks £500 mill held in KSF London rest in Iceland. So hopefully a lot is recoverable...but a tricky legal situation with frozen assets in London..and UK liquidators as KSF IOM was a subsidiary of head office Iceland NOT KSF London. Get your UK MP of birthplace to pressure UK Gov to respect ownership of KFS IOM deposits.
sadly Iceland as a country is bankrupt...but the IMF( and the West) not wishing to let Russia gain political advantage ...may rescue them with funds. The islands banking regime was controlled by an inept government of a small island jurisdiction( pop only 300k) with their ex politicians running their FSC and completely out of their depth (Sound Familiar !!!)
But they are not criminals I'm sure just plain inept. They are still promising to honour the debts of KFS Iceland now nationalised, and that includes the full deposits on the IOM.

Meanwhile our Gov here has passed a new Compensation scheme and this will apply IF the trigger event ..winding up the KFS IOM actually takes place. So as of now all depositors with accounts in Individual names will be covered for £50k or £100k in joint accounts...FOR CERTAIN. Further the new scheme seeks to improve on the time to payout by allowing the scheme administrator to borrow funds to speed payout BUT at present the best available is the use of an enhanced levy of about £500k per bank licensed here which amounts to an annual levy of about £18 million which means waiting several years for payout.
Further the moment the new scheme became law on Oct 9th AT A STROKE THE GOV REMOVED ALL COMPENSATION RIGHTS OF ALL OTHER DEPOSITORS.
This includes all business accounts and ironically myself as a pensioner forced by the same government department to hold my individual life savings....my SIPP pension funds..in a trust fund. All trust funds including all charities on the Island have all protection removed since Thursday ( previously we had £15k cover as 75% £20k max)
now we have an interesting situation developing for Non individual account holders in KSF as deposits were frozen as of Tuesday 7th Oct when the old Compensation was in force , and these deposits were first made with compensation in place ..so I doubt it is legally enforceable for the Manx Gov to remove this protection after the event albeit they will argue a winding up trigger has yet to take place, so they are free to change the rules.
they are claiming the question is under review and amendments should be passed before the KFS compensation trigger event (Winding up) takes place probably at the end of October .
BUT RIGHT NOW ALL NON INDIVIDUAL DEPOSITS IN ALL 37 LICENSED DEPOSIT TAKERS ON THE ISLE OF MAN HAVE ZERO PROTECTION
And a lot of banks could fail before the end of the month. They should have kept the cover of the old scheme running until the new scheme was properly constructed.